Possible Reasons for a Bad Gun Season?

[Five Seasons]

2. Early opening of archery season (Oct. 1).

 

bahahahahhaha :rofl:

 

[Live2Hunt]

All I'm saying is I haven't had a problem seeing nor killing deer. There obviously has to be an issue if you aren't seeing them on your property. I don't know how many acres you have to hunt on, but unless you let other people come on and shoot all your deer, you really have no excuse other than poor tactics. I say if you have been seeing deer for the acclaimed 70 years, then you did something different this year to push the deer out, or you just don't know where to find them. I had trail cams set out too, didn't see hardly anything on them. Didn't see one of the multiple bucks I saw on our farm until I got in the woods and patterned the deer. (Poor camera placement) It wasn't until gun season that I actually closed in on and killed the buck I had patterned. All from seeing him with my actual eyes, finding his sign and figuring out what he was doing. I'm no expert hunter, but I am learning and I put in some good work this year with time in the woods. Maybe those old trustworthy, guaranteed stands aren't producing like they used to. Maybe they aren't feeding/bedding in the same areas. Tough telling. We scout later summer and stay out of the woods until the season opens. We use climbers. hunt a bunch of different areas. Go in, set up and hunt, get the hell out. No messing around. Scout on the way in and way out. Once the season is over, we don't enter those woods again until the following summer. It works.

You cant say its just hunting tactics..I hunt state land Tonawanda WMA, a highly pressured area from August (dog field trails),Duck & goose hunting, pheasant hunters (which there were extremely high numbers of guys with dogs),small game hunters and then us deer guys. Its a different kind of hunting compared to private and even S. tier WMA's.    If people are having the same results for years and then there are no deer sightings you cant just say tactics. I have seen 3-doe during the entire gun season -300 yards away,  thats it.  I get out more than just the weekends. I am normally a sitter and at seasons end did walk and stalk without seeing a single thing.Very little as far as sign goes (rubs ,scrapes) but there are some trails being used.  My take on this......Very hard winter on the herd. I found one buck skull-4pt, and had another guy walk out with 5, and said there were doe skulls there also. Deer numbers are down and the guys that are getting deer are doing so on private land because of less pressure. DEC is doing a terrible job on the management end, and when asked the told me there were no issues as far as winter kill.When I go into the woods at seasons end and find acorns still on the ground there is an issue. Weather has been the game changer as most deer movement has been during the night. Even road kill numbers have been down as I have only seen 3 roadkills in that area the entire season. Usually there are 3 every other day. This weekend went out to southern Tier and had no deer siting but sign was a bit more prevalent.  No road kills on a 2 hour road trip in the heart of deer country? 

 

Edited December 15, 2015 by Live2Hunt

[Five Seasons]

Here is some good news. The Young Forest initiative.

http://www.eregulations.com/newyork/hunting/the-young-forest-initiative/

 

great to read. i wonder if they'll even touch the adk park though.

 

[The_Real_TCIII]

Im no great hunter but I'm a persistent one and kill a lot of deer. One thing I try to do is move around, dont hunt the same way I did the year before and the year before that and expect different results. For gun season I try to hunt in thick cover with the exception being opening weekend. That weekend I like to be able to see a lot of woods but after that I hunt tight spots. Deer wont be out in the open once the pressure really hits. I know, thanks Captain Obvious. But sometimes its hard to break old patterns and just go to that comfy easy to get to stand. Force yourself to throw that climber on your back and get into some new areas. Maybe not even that far from your old ones 

 

Im also a terrible turkey hunter but I just keep going until I get one!

[bendermelissa2]

Less hunters... I no that sounds crazy, but there are more tree stand hunters than drivers, and less of both this year.. Deer are not forced to move.. Two years ago hunters were everywhere.. I'd run into 5-7 hunters opening day,,, this year ... 1 hunter..

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[Five Seasons]

Less hunters... I no that sounds crazy, but there are more tree stand hunters than drivers, and less of both this year.. Deer are not forced to move.. Two years ago hunters were everywhere.. I'd run into 5-7 hunters opening day,,, this year ... 1 hunter..

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welcome. father and I had the same conversation. Old school gun hunters poking around their lot are a thing of the past. Too much info and also the newer hunter, or the hunter who is left is smarter. has his treestand picked out, understands that drives aren't good for the land. and the end result is we see less deer.

[bendermelissa2]

welcome. father and I had the same conversation. Old school gun hunters poking around their lot are a thing of the past. Too much info and also the newer hunter, or the hunter who is left is smarter. has his treestand picked out, understands that drives aren't good for the land. and the end result is we see less deer.

Yes,,, I am not a driver, lost a good friend that way (shot in the neck).... It is safer to sit and wait or be in stand,

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[dbHunterNY]

great to read. i wonder if they'll even touch the adk park though.

 

DEC can't touch the dacks without federal approval and a whole lot of BS.  it's not really state land.  it's a national park.

 

i wish they could do something it'd help the wildlife a little more.  there's some that don't care about holding capacity though and would rather it remain untouched.  i think a happy medium would be nice.

Edited December 15, 2015 by dbHunterNY

[Larry]

That is another thing PISS – POOR FOREST MANAGEMENT.

[16. ga hunter]

An FYI Adirondacks are not a national park. It is a New York State forest preserve and is managed by the Adirondack Park Agency a state entity. The Adirondack Park Agency was set up by then Governor Nelson Rockefeller. Regardless the preserve is protected by New York State laws keeping it "forever wild" making it very difficult for forest management.

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[Curmudgeon]

DEC can't touch the dacks without federal approval and a whole lot of BS.  it's not really state land.  it's a national park.

 

 

Actually, Adirondack Park protection is in the NYS Constitution. That is why the environmental community will be fighting a constitutional convention.

 

The young forest initiative is clearly focused on promoting game species, in spite of the mention of a few others. Call a spade a spade.

[upstate]

welcome. father and I had the same conversation. Old school gun hunters poking around their lot are a thing of the past. Too much info and also the newer hunter, or the hunter who is left is smarter. has his treestand picked out, understands that drives aren't good for the land. and the end result is we see less deer.

This is a big factor in deer sightings.

Organized still hunts works much better than drives per se. The days of banging pans, bells, whistles, barking and shouting are over. I showed one of the biggest advocate of such drives the brutal truth when we watched two 140 inch bucks simply wait out the drivers and sneak through the drive.

We take hours to walk over grown fields , woods and trash lots. The deer eventually roll out. As a walker you know where you are, as well as guys next to you. You know where stands are. You are safe or you don't come back.

I've watched family get excluded from hunting because they don't stay in line.

Of course, we don't have the land to do this any longer.

Long story short

Hunter access and lack of hunting and hunters is huge part of the issue. Sitting all day is just that, sitting.

Edited December 16, 2015 by upstate

[The_Field_Ager]

Actually, Adirondack Park protection is in the NYS Constitution. 

 

 

You also have UN control to contend with now. The Daks are now labelled an 'international' biosphere reserve.

In 1972, our government signed the United Nations' World Heritage Treaty, a treaty that creates "World Heritage Sites" and Biosphere Reserves." Selected for their cultural, historical or natural significance, national governments are obligated to protect these landmarks under U.N. mandate. Since 1972, 68 percent of all U.S. national parks, monuments and preserves have been designated as World Heritage Sites.

Although it has not happened yet, under the World Heritage Treaty the U.N. has the legal right to someday restrict us, as American citizens, from visiting our national parks

 

In 2002 Senate Bill  S. 2575 (American Land Sovereignty Protection Act)

was introduced to protect sovereign control of our parks. It was not enacted.

[Five Seasons]

Hunter access and lack of hunting and hunters is huge part of the issue. Sitting all day is just that, sitting.

 

for gun hunting yes, and I know that's the subject of this thread. As a bowhunter, lack of pressure is your best friend. It's really funny how different the seasons are.

[NYbuck50]

weather i believe was the biggest factor. deer dont hit corn fields when its 60,they go to browse and hard mast.

[upstate]

for gun hunting yes, and I know that's the subject of this thread. As a bowhunter, lack of pressure is your best friend. It's really funny how different the seasons are.

Which is why I tell gun hunters they don't know what they're missing. Bow season is great but tough because harvesting can be very tough. But you get to see deer in the natural environment. Not spooked.

I'm also a firm believer that bow hunting makes you a better gun hunter. You're more patient. See the woods differently. But that's just me.

[The_Real_TCIII]

Bow season is only better if you like better weather, fewer hunters, and unpressured deer

[Lever action]

The warm weather and lack of hunters is what I believe caused lack of deer sightings.The deer simply aren't  moving much during daylight hrs as our trail cameras are telling us. The deer are there they just don't move much until after dark.

[Culvercreek hunt club]

Nice weather=hunters able to stay on stand as long as they want. 

 

Freezing cold= hunters moving around=moving deer around that are hunkered down from pressure. 

[turkeyfeathers]

Buddy checked trail cams from over the weekend to last night. 5 bucks , 40 deer in all. This is a very small area. Not one pic of deer in daylight

[16. ga hunter]

I believe a large contributing factor is guys just sitting on stand also. I quietly still hunted most of the season on state lands and saw plenty of deer. It's not that they were not moving during the day they were just moving little. And many I saw were chowing on acorns. You don't need to do drives but slowly and quietly moving through the woods with the wind in your face increases your action.

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[dbHunterNY]

You also have UN control to contend with now. The Daks are now labelled an 'international' biosphere reserve.

In 1972, our government signed the United Nations' World Heritage Treaty, a treaty that creates "World Heritage Sites" and Biosphere Reserves." Selected for their cultural, historical or natural significance, national governments are obligated to protect these landmarks under U.N. mandate. Since 1972, 68 percent of all U.S. national parks, monuments and preserves have been designated as World Heritage Sites.

Although it has not happened yet, under the World Heritage Treaty the U.N. has the legal right to someday restrict us, as American citizens, from visiting our national parks

 

In 2002 Senate Bill  S. 2575 (American Land Sovereignty Protection Act)

was introduced to protect sovereign control of our parks. It was not enacted.

 

where did you hear that they are?  never even heard of that before in any conversations about that Adirondacks.  not to sound like an idiot either but it's the first I've heard of that treaty.

[The_Field_Ager]

where did you hear that they are?  never even heard of that before in any conversations about that Adirondacks.  not to sound like an idiot either but it's the first I've heard of that treaty.

 

You'll enjoy doing some research then . I've known for at least 15 years. It's not something the powers that be like to talk about. There was huge public outcry by locals at the Grand canyon when the UN heritage site sign went up. They were forced to take it down, but the site remains under UN mandated control.

 

 

 

The Champlain-Adirondack Biosphere Reserve straddles the border of north-central New York and northwestern Vermont. Lake Champlain, the sixth largest lake in the United States, and the Adirondack and Green Mountains are the central features of the biosphere reserve. It includes extensive temperate coniferous and deciduous forests as well as large numbers of lakes, bogs, and freshwater wetlands. The primary goal of the Champlain-Adirondack Biosphere Reserve is to use education, research, and demonstration projects to encourage social and economic vitality and to preserve and improve the environmental health of the region.

 

http://www.unesco.org/mabdb/br/brdir/directory/biores.asp?code=USA+45&mode=all

 

http://nwri.org/the-wildlands-project/un-biospheres-and-world-heritage-parks/

Edited December 16, 2015 by Papist

[Andy 3F]

I'd love to take a few coyotes. Wheres the best spots for them in region 3?

[LTC24]

Was it a good year or bad year? That all depends on your perspective. If you got to spend some quality time in the woods with your son, son-in-law or buddy then I count that as a good year, if you got a deer that's a bonus. In my neck of the woods, there is no shortage of deer. Trail cameras and sign all over the place prove that. Were they scarce during the SZ gun season - sure they were. 90 acres of standing corn on the farm next door, acorns galore and 60 acres of 6ft high golden rod gave the deer all food and cover they needed.

 

We didn't get the two big eight points that showed up on cameras during the rut, but with patience and some luck we each shot good deer. The one thing I did notice is that some of the fellas that hunt nearby didn't give the season much of a chance. They were usually out of the woods by noon and packed it in after the first weekend. In my area there are so few bow and crossbow hunters that if they all got deer it would not make a dent in the population. With predictions of a mild winter the herd should be bigger next year.

 

It will be interesting to see what kind of spin DEC puts on the season.

 

Merry Christmas to all.