Thier getting closer!!!!!

[growalot]

I find how you guys use quotes amusing.....seriously .....

.and if he lied...well I nor my husband can surmise the reason...

So does the DEC lie...one way or the other....I have to say  yes....reasons...who the hell knows....should a person sarcastically  dismiss  another persons experience? ...Well life's taught me no...so  there ya go... [img alt=]http://huntingny.com/forums/Smileys/akyhne/wink.gif[/img] 

I'll also say that I worked in the pet industry for a # of years...and  there are or where auctions held in different southern states where a  person could bid on and buy all kinds of "exotic" animals...I'm talking  from kudamundaes(sp) to giraffes....was transporting these across state  line legal...I don't think so...but ppl were doing it all the same.

and just one more thought....feral cats...we all know they are out  there....how many do you have on cam....me...not a one... but I see them  all the time

I will not assume that you'll ever get the point......so...I'll just go with WHAT EVER....lol

[growalot]

see there ya go I couldn't pass this up...

One it wasn't making it personal...just putting a time reference to it and ...really sorry here ..

FYI, there have been reports of bears wandering through the area I am  from for far longer than I have been around. My father has told me many  times about them.

Really?  Did he have PROOF!.....

[SteveB]

The fact you can't come up with a reason for him telling you a "story" in no way proves that his story is, or could possibly be true. Neither does posting obscure, hypothetical what if scenarios. Sorry.

[growalot]

Sorry Steve...what obscure hypothetical ?....Ppl release exotics all the time..whether they survive or not is another thing

Now if you want the true reason I post what was said...here goes...OOhh wait ...I have no PROOF...other than my ears heard this...and he is one of very few DEC ppl I'd trust

A person from the DEC and I were walking to a call they answered...not mine....we were chatting about this and  I mentioned the lets say kitchen episode...and what he relayed to me was this...Listen we get the  Cat calls all the time...pardon pun....many years ago there was a domestic cougar...in the southern tier that was found....and that started it ...well some ..workers (lets say)....decided theyed start the whole Blk panthers from south Carolina thing when asked...Mind you don't let that whole Carolina Panthers thing ...go over your head....Now I know that ...NOT ALL...but many DEC ppl aren't...lets say keen on the general public...but come on!...so since then I figure I'll give them what they wanted...and repeat  the kitchen episode as often as possible...maybe ...just maybe...when the guys are sitting around the table having a coffee brake....they'll think 2-3x's on the next little jewel one of them comes up with...ya think :

Do alot of DEC have a tough job ...yep...do they have to deal with over emotional ...government disliking ppl on a daily bases...yep...but I see.... that as all the more reason for them not to fuel the fire...sometimes it blows back to burn ya

[WNYBuckHunter]

see there ya go I couldn't pass this up...

One it wasn't making it personal...just putting a time reference to it and ...really sorry here ..

FYI, there have been reports of bears wandering through the area I am  from for far longer than I have been around. My father has told me many  times about them.

Really?  Did he have PROOF!.....

I didnt infer that there were bears there for sure, I said there were reports. With the advent of trail cams, etc there is now proof.

[cwhite]

Are we at least in an agreement that there is the occasional cougar that roams in the wild in NY in the form of an escaped or released pet?

I am trying to get the video uploaded but need authorization to do so and am meeting resistance.  In the mean time go to the following links.  The bigcatnews site has a link to the video that was on the news but it comes up broken for me.  I have been in the field where the video was taken.  This cat stood a good 2+ feet tall at the shoulder and even skeptics are believing it is a released cougar.  This video is authentic.

http://bigcatnews.blogspot.com/2006/03/mountain-lion-filmed-loose-in-ny.html

http://old.thedailystar.com/sports/2006/03/03/spbrock5.html

  For the record I do not believe in conspiracies, except for the Kennedy assassination and UFO cover ups, of course.  I don't believe that there is an elaborate yet secret program headed up by NYSDEC aiming to reinrtoduce cougars, wolves, sasquatch, champ, or any other extirpated/legendary creature into the woods of NY.  I do believe that there is the occasional situation that a wolf (more common) or cougar is roaming in the wild in NY.  If enough of these animals are released they could eventually mate.  Look at the pythons in the Everglades for proof of that scenario happening.  I predict feral pigs will be here before cougars are populating NY. 

[Pygmy]

I don't think that there is any argument over the fact that released/escaped pet cougars could or have  existed in NY... I believe that there a few documented cases..In at least one case the cat had been declawed.. PROBABLY not a bad idea if you have a pet pumacougar..Imagine what one of those suckers could do to your favorite COUCH... ....

The main point is that there is no proof of any breeding population of cougars in the wild...

And the stubborn allegation that the state has clandestinely stocked them is ludicrous... Pure unadulterated BS... 

[cwhite]

The main point is that there is no proof of any breeding population of cougars in the wild...

And the stubborn allegation that the state has clandestinely stocked them is ludicrous... Pure unadulterated BS...

Agreed.  DEC releases trout, salmon, walleye's, pheasants and in some instances turkey's and they are having a hard enough time doing that. 

[WNYBuckHunter]

I don't think that there is any argument over the fact that released/escaped pet cougars could or have  existed in NY... I believe that there a few documented cases..In at least one case the cat had been declawed.. PROBABLY not a bad idea if you have a pet pumacougar..Imagine what one of those suckers could do to your favorite COUCH... ....

The main point is that there is no proof of any breeding population of cougars in the wild...

And the stubborn allegation that the state has clandestinely stocked them is ludicrous... Pure unadulterated BS...

Exactly

[nyantler]

I have heard the same about the DEC re-introducing wolves in the adirondacks.. I have yet to see a wolf track...

[ELMER J. FUDD]

Apparently they are in Ontario, Canada.

http://www.mnr.gov.on.ca/en/Business/Wildlife/1ColumnSubPage/STDPROD_068840.html?CSB_ic-name=features&CSB_ic-info=topic-fw_CougarResearch_WRDS_Eng

Text size:  S  M  L 

                            Are There Cougars in Ontario?

It’s a question Ministry of Natural Resources staff are often asked. After all, the last known cougar in the province was shot way back in 1884. There’s never been a definitive photo taken of a cougar in Ontario.

How do you prove cougars live in Ontario? For the last five years, ministry researchers have been looking for evidence. With the public’s help, they have documented cougar tracks. They’ve found scat (feces) which has tested positive for cougar DNA. And they’ve seen evidence of cougars in the distinctive way other animals are killed.

“In those five years, we’ve only collected about 30 pieces of evidence from the far northwest of the province to the south,” says ministry senior research scientist Rick Rosatte. “So while we know there are cougars in the province, we also know they are extremely rare.” 

Ministry researchers are still trying to get that elusive photograph of a cougar. Rosatte interviews people who think they've spotted a cougar. Almost all sightings turn out to be bobcats, fisher, deer, coyotes, lynx – even house cats. But if the sighting sounds likely, he sets up a camera that is triggered by motion and heat.

What have the cameras captured? So far, no cougars. Check out the other wildlife one camera caught.

“We’d love to get a definitive photo of a cougar,” Rosatte says. “But these animals are very fast, and their range is vast – they can travel more than 1,000 kilometres.”

Researchers are also trying to learn where Ontario cougars come from.

“It’s likely that escaped or intentionally released cougars – from zoos and private homes – are responsible for at least some of the sightings,” Rosatte says. “Or they could be a genetic mix from different sources – remnants of a small native population or migrants from the west.”

Video of supposed mountain lion (very far away) in the Adirondacks.

[nyantler]

hmmm.. not really seeing anything that looked like amountain lion to me.. but then again it didn't look like anything in particular... could have been a dog, cat, fox.. how could you tell from that video?

[ELMER J. FUDD]

I can't tell.

[fasteddie]

I had it on full screen and couldn't tell what it was . It looked like one of my shakey videos !

[Larry]

Look here is what the DEC has said about ML’s in NY there is no breeding population of ML’s in this state. They have also said there may from time to time be an escapee or a release pet.

As for the DEC releasing ML’s and keeping it a secret do you think anyone in this state can keep a secret. I don’t think so! 

[erussell]

I don't care if its someones lost pet, an escapee, or a native of NY. If I see one it's getting shot at. According to the article they take down a deer every 6 to 12 days. Thats like 30 deer or more a yr if you include coyote kills of young deer into that equation also. I don't know of anywhere in NY the deer population can take a beating like that and have hunting stay open if the population of big cats were to take hold in NY. Just look at the mess of the Elk and Deer populations the re-introduction of the Wolf has caused out west. As far as black bears go, I have yet to see anything that they do to effect the deer population in my area. And I see bear everytime I go out, saw 6 in one day this yr. I think they are just as happy to lay around and eat grubs, acorns, and mushrooms. Though I find it a little freaky when thay follow me around or hang around my treestands when im hunting. But for the most part they keep thier distance or move away quickly to another area. Im sure they would down a deer fawn if given the opportunity, but i have serious doubt that they actually hunt deer, so I have no problem with them other than they ruin about half of my hunting excursions to certain areas.

[G-Man]

Black bear are the largest predator of fawns in the east...much more than the coyote. As for the mountain lions i really don't think i'll worry about them or maybe i will as much as i worry about being abducted by aliens.. ;D    Matter of fact i bet there are more video's and abduction stories about aliens in new york than there are of wild mountain lions......

[cynthiafu]

doesnt move like a cougar would low to the ground  . looks like it could of been a fox or dog

[WhiteTailBuckDeer]

LOL theres another great video to prove theres MLs in NY. I think my 15 month old coulda held the camera steadier and if MLs are here and so hard to find or see do you think it woulda stayed there while a car was sitting filming it. I think not...

[cwhite]

To me the animal moves like a cat but you can't see the tail.  That is the thing that really sticks out, kind of like a long club.  I'm guessing a bobcat.  Possibly a lynx but I highly doubt it. 

I have a mountain lion story......  In 2000 I was walking in the desert east of Douglas, AZ and started to drop into a wash. (dried up river bed) About two steps down the 12' drop I came face to face (less than 8' away) with a 100+ pound female.  The first thing I noticed on her was the long tail that you would expect her to swing from jungle branches with.  This wasn't the first time I saw a mountain lion in AZ but instead of running like they usually do, she just got up and circled around me staring the whole time.  I kept watching her as I backed away down into the wash and then I noticed the den with at least two babies.  I had a handgun but if she charged it would have been a toss-up if I could have drawn it fast enough to shoot.  Then if I did draw the gun and got a shot off it would have been pure luck if I hit her.  If I did hit her the chances that I hit her hard enough to incapacitate or kill her were slim.  Fortunately I backed away and she didn't come after me.  For days after the encounter I could have made diamonds from coal in mear minutes.  Its rare that I feel intimidated but that cat scared the hell out of me.     

[nyantler]

good story CW.. thats one to tell the grandchildren

[WNYBuckHunter]

Judging from the size of it compared to the objects near it on the bank of the stream, it isnt very big, probably a bobcat, but its hard to tell. Its not a mountain lion though, way too small.

[fasteddie]

CW ----- Those butt muscles tighten right up don't they !  ???

[cwhite]

CW ----- Those butt muscles tighten right up don't they !  ???

Tighten is an understatement.  Petrify better describes it. 

[erussell]

Black bear are the largest predator of fawns in the east...much more than the coyote. 

I dont see it, I have poked through my fare share of bear scat with a stick just to see what they are eating and I have never seen deer hair or any type of hair in it. Now up north in the Adirondacks where food is scarce I dont know, but in the southern zone I have yet to see it. Now the coyote scat I see is usually full of deer hair ( and the occasional cat claws    ) Anyone ever see bear scat with deer hair in it?