First-light

Frost Heave

Recommended Posts

Second time this has happened in the bath room. Seems that the main drain to septic system is subject to frost heave. Do I have to drain water away from this area? It is wet back of the cabin. 

Be nice if there was an expandable boot I could install on the line. Pushed the toilet over, bolts were not on the screws to hold it in place. Any thoughts would be appreciated. 

IMG_20190.jpg

  • Like 1

"We Feed 'em"

"He Breeds 'em"

Legends Lodge, "Where Legends are born"

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Seems very unlikely to me that your septic line being pushed up would lift your toilet. Does the main line exit the house very close to that toilet?

I would think the main line would flex enough to not move your toilet,even if it does heave up a tad.

Also,there is a rubber sleeve you can install on the line,two hoseclamps on either end.

Edited by BowmanMike

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Damn, that sucks..........

Recently we had a problem with a large (very expensive) casement window that wouldn't latch.  Today we went to check it out and after about 30 minutes of monkeying with it the homeowner states that they've had all kinds of trouble with a yard gate and back door that is right next to the window in question.  Seems as though a major frost upheaval has upset the apple cart.  Major foundation cracks around the room are seen to by investigative peons (me and my boss) confirming the fact that the homeowners is f*c%ed. :(

Good luck with your turlet.........

  • Like 1

Please support the hunting of Mourning Dove In New York State.  For information, visit nydovehunting.weebly.com/

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 minutes ago, BowmanMike said:

Seems very unlikely to me that your septic line being pushed up would lift your toilet. Does the main line exit the house very close to that toilet?

I would think the main line would flex enough to not move your toilet,even if it does heave up a tad.

Also,there is a rubber sleeve you can install on the line,two hoseclamps on either end.

It exits about 4 feet from where the toilet drain comes down. I might look into that rubber sleeve. Thanks


"We Feed 'em"

"He Breeds 'em"

Legends Lodge, "Where Legends are born"

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

What if the back side of the cabin was sinking? Jump ship? lol Half the cabin is on piers the other foundation. I don't know just throwing it out there.


"We Feed 'em"

"He Breeds 'em"

Legends Lodge, "Where Legends are born"

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

That's exactly how I found my toilet once when my 280 lbs sister-in-law spent a weekend at our place.  LOL  I kid you not.  Glad she didn't fall thru the floor below.

Anyway, just trying to cheer you up, Burt.  Hope you find out what the problem is and get it resolved.

  • Like 2
  • Haha 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Maybe someone busted in and stepped on the can, then dumped it...........??


Please support the hunting of Mourning Dove In New York State.  For information, visit nydovehunting.weebly.com/

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I doubt the line moved that much I believe your foundation moved not the septic line


I've hunted almost everyday of my life.. the rest have been wasted!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, G-Man said:

I doubt the line moved that much I believe your foundation moved not the septic line

OK I'll check but in the corner is the hot water heater and pressure tank for well. That would of moved also. I'll check those things out. 

I guess the skirting should be compressed also another thing to look at. Thanks


"We Feed 'em"

"He Breeds 'em"

Legends Lodge, "Where Legends are born"

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, First-light said:

OK I'll check but in the corner is the hot water heater and pressure tank for well. That would of moved also. I'll check those things out. 

I guess the skirting should be compressed also another thing to look at. Thanks

The reason I say foundation moved and not pipe is the bolts that hold toilet on are attached to flange that is attached to pipe ,for the nuts to strip off the floor had to raise and pipe stay so it was forced off .. it pipe rose the flange would raise out of floor with toilet on it. The heater and pressure tank aren't attached to floor so they wouldn't be toppled 


I've hunted almost everyday of my life.. the rest have been wasted!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 minutes ago, G-Man said:

The reason I say foundation moved and not pipe is the bolts that hold toilet on are attached to flange that is attached to pipe ,for the nuts to strip off the floor had to raise and pipe stay so it was forced off .. it pipe rose the flange would raise out of floor with toilet on it. The heater and pressure tank aren't attached to floor so they wouldn't be toppled 

I think Burt mentioned that the nuts were not in place

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It absolutely could be frost heave on the line. if that goes through the floor and underground, but no below frost line and then a horizontal run. Is it dirt below that floor?  Ours did the same thing at camp and it may not be a standing water issue. some soils are very susceptible to frost heavy. Have you ever walked around your camp are and seem tall frost and soil formations grow from the surface of the ground just over night on a very very cold night?

Ours was bolted down and the T bolts were pulled right through the PVC flange. 


"Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote." -- Benjamin Franklin

"The trouble with Socialism is, sooner or later you run out of other people's money." - Margaret Thatcher

"When you subsidize poverty and failure, you get more of both.." - James Dale Davidson, National Taxpayers Union

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
12 hours ago, land 1 said:

friend had the same issue turns out wasnt the septic line but frozen ground moving actual camp it was on piers

wouldn't that have lifted the camp up and pull the pipe apart rather than pushing the toilet up?

  • Like 1

"Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote." -- Benjamin Franklin

"The trouble with Socialism is, sooner or later you run out of other people's money." - Margaret Thatcher

"When you subsidize poverty and failure, you get more of both.." - James Dale Davidson, National Taxpayers Union

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Need to institute a no smoking rule in the bathroom... let us know what you find..

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk


'life is hard, its harder when your stupid' John Wayne

'The wisdom of hindsight, so useful to historians and indeed authors of memoirs, is sadly denied to practicing politicians' Margaret Thatcher

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, Culvercreek hunt club said:

wouldn't that have lifted the camp up and pull the pipe apart rather than pushing the toilet up?

Nuts weren't on toilet so if floor lifted and.pipe stayed it would lift toilet off bolts.. if pipe lifted where flange attaches to floor would be ripped out or flange snapped..looks like floor lifted toilet off bolts and when it settled it didnt fall back on them and tipped

  • Like 2

I've hunted almost everyday of my life.. the rest have been wasted!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Discharge line should be surrounded in crushed stone, if it isn't I would do that.

Which side is of the cabin is this on? the foundation side or the pier side ? If it's on the pier side, are they sunken piers or sitting on grade ? If they are on grade, I'd also look into having them dug below frost line and putting Crete down there.

Another possibility is that septic holding tank has shifted ( also should be in stone ). The "wet" you see could be overflow from tank. If something's moving enough to knock over you crapper there could be other issues as well.

As it sits, beware of the methane gas !!!

Sent from my LM-V405 using Tapatalk

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thank you all for your input. What I saw today was two lines that connect to the main drain, toilet. They are pitched now the wrong way. Thus believing the cabin did not sink but the main drain line heaved. There is a lot of water behind cabin and also where the main line goes into the ground. I believe I have to put in some drainage to alleviate the problem.  Please keep suggestions coming. Thank you all.


"We Feed 'em"

"He Breeds 'em"

Legends Lodge, "Where Legends are born"

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Thank you all for your input. What I saw today was two lines that connect to the main drain, toilet. They are pitched now the wrong way. Thus believing the cabin did not sink but the main drain line heaved. There is a lot of water behind cabin and also where the main line goes into the ground. I believe I have to put in some drainage to alleviate the problem.  Please keep suggestions coming. Thank you all.
Stone those lines !!

Sent from my LM-V405 using Tapatalk

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 hours ago, TreeGuy said:

Stone those lines !!

Sent from my LM-V405 using Tapatalk
 

Dig the lines up and put gravel around them? How much deeper than the line should I go?

 


"We Feed 'em"

"He Breeds 'em"

Legends Lodge, "Where Legends are born"

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Dig the lines up and put gravel around them? How much deeper than the line should I go?
 
They should have been stoned originally. If there's none, I'd say anywhere between 6-8" all around pipe. Crushed #1

Sent from my LM-V405 using Tapatalk

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I have similar problems at my camp, which is up on posts. I had to redo all the posts properly which put an end to the camp moving, but still have problems with the plumbing. 

My toilet drain exits the floor, then I have a gas trap before it goes to the ground unfortunately it enters the ground at a long shallow angle, which lifts the line up and down. It only goes to a 55 gallon drum, which needs to be improved. If you can take the horizontal septic line below frost line from directly below the toilet, then surround the vertical pipe with gravel as mentioned, it largely eliminates any heave on the pipe. use a couple pieces of the flexible rubber elbows at the trap, and that will also minimize the heave.  

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

What a pain in the ass this is......

  • Like 1

Please support the hunting of Mourning Dove In New York State.  For information, visit nydovehunting.weebly.com/

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.