myths and facts...

[sits in trees]

I think that Crossbow Season should be during muzzlelloader season and allow Crossbow hunting during Late Bow Season, think it would work for everybody.

I my opinion, if Crossbow was only allowed in Regular gun season then why shouldn't Bow be allowed?

why not just allow muzzlelloader be in regular season too? Would be too much traffic in the woods with all the gun hunters and bow/crossbow hunters in the same season.

Also don't get why Crossbow is compared to Bow or a Rifle/Shotgun or any type of gun it's neither if you ask me yeah sure you can aim it like a gun but it shoots like a bow.

You can hunt with bow during rifle season if that's what floats yer boat. You can also use a muzzle loader during regular season.

[Mossyberg500]

i thought you couldn't my bad. But still doesn't mean that crossbow should just be used in regular season, it's not a firearm so it should have it's own special season like a bow or muzzlelloader. just to make it fair.

[fasteddie]

i thought you couldn't my bad. But still doesn't mean that crossbow should just be used in regular season, it's not a firearm so it should have it's own special season like a bow or muzzlelloader. just to make it fair.

 

Fair isn't the name of the game . What is Fair to one person is a hinderance to another .

 

[mike rossi]

If the issue is simply to reduce deer numbers than why not just give out more tags to the people that are already hunting?  I'd gladly take a couple more to get the numbers down.    

I don't know but you sure can suggest that during the public comment phase. This sounds counter intuitive but one aspect of the DEC's responsibilities is to fairly distribute the resource. Under that logic you killing ten deer is not preferred over ten hunters killing one deer each.

 

Perhaps the people already hunting are not shooting does? Admittedly I don't see the crossbow crowd doing it differently. Its not the crossbow that kills female deer, its the shooter that kills female deer.... Why not tighten up restrictions on predator harvest and restore wolves to the state?

Edited April 8, 2014 by mike rossi

[d-bone20917]

I don't know but you sure can suggest that during the public comment phase. This sounds counter intuitive but one aspect of the DEC's responsibilities is to fairly distribute the resource. Under that logic you killing ten deer is not preferred over ten hunters killing one deer each.

 

Perhaps the people already hunting are not shooting does? Admittedly I don't see the crossbow crowd doing it differently. Its not the crossbow that kills female deer, its the shooter that kills female deer.... Why not tighten up restrictions on predator harvest and restore wolves to the state?

 

I posted a similar response on another thread, but the introduction of wolves would be a huge mistake for the areas that currently have low densities.  Look at what they've done to the elk herds in Montana.  They are killing machines, much more so than coyotes.  Some states allow unlimited doe take, why not try that and let people eat them vs other predators?  This would primarily be for the southern zone, it isn't really an issue up north where I hunt.  I can't even get a doe permit in 6N.   

Edited April 8, 2014 by d-bone20917

[Vince1]

introducing Wolves just seems a bit off to me. would piss me off if they brought wolves in NY.

 

can imagine my dog in the woods getting torn apart by a pack of wolves, or them getting a bit to close to the public after they destroy a deer herd

 

seriously, if they cant figure out a way to keep the deer under control, and they are letting wild pigs start to invade, what are they gonna do when wolves start breeding like crazy.

 

couple coyotes are nothing compared to a pack of wolves

 

 

[Five Seasons]

I my opinion, if Crossbow was only allowed in Regular gun season then why shouldn't Bow be allowed?

 

 

bow is allowed during regular. so is mz. Essenitally any legal hunting implement. It's why it's called regular season in the books and not "gun season". I know guys who hunt small properties who continue to bow hunt in areas where guns aren't safe. My dad takes his MZ out because of the extended range in shotgun only areas. It just doesn't go both ways, you can't  use a gun during bow. for now. until populations continue to rise and more hunters complain that hunting is too hard.

 

Up until last year you used to be legally allowed to use an xbow during regular... should have left it that way

Edited April 9, 2014 by Belo

[fasteddie]

Belo - The only fault I find with the above post "you can't  use a gun during bow." .... a gun can be used during the "Youth Season" .

[Five Seasons]

good catch. I heard youth hunt was up in the air this year?

[Culvercreek hunt club]

good catch. I heard youth hunt was up in the air this year?

I heard that too but can't seem to find any updates on the topic.

[Doc]

You can hunt with bow during rifle season if that's what floats yer boat. You can also use a muzzle loader during regular season.

The unwritten rule used to be that lesser weapons could be used in the seasons of the more effective weapons, but not the other way around. It looks like that rule of thumb or that kind of thinking no longer applies.

[mike rossi]

I posted a similar response on another thread, but the introduction of wolves would be a huge mistake for the areas that currently have low densities.  Look at what they've done to the elk herds in Montana.  They are killing machines, much more so than coyotes.  Some states allow unlimited doe take, why not try that and let people eat them vs other predators?  This would primarily be for the southern zone, it isn't really an issue up north where I hunt.  I can't even get a doe permit in 6N.   

 

introducing Wolves just seems a bit off to me. would piss me off if they brought wolves in NY.

 

can imagine my dog in the woods getting torn apart by a pack of wolves, or them getting a bit to close to the public after they destroy a deer herd

 

seriously, if they cant figure out a way to keep the deer under control, and they are letting wild pigs start to invade, what are they gonna do when wolves start breeding like crazy.

 

couple coyotes are nothing compared to a pack of wolves

 

Do you think wolves or other predators create less opportunities for trophy class bucks? They might, but I am not sure they do, but it is pretty apparent that trophy bucks rate very high in terms of hunter satisfaction.

[G-Man]

That's all this really comes down to for people for or against it is hunter satisfaction. The DEC really doesn't seem to care about that to much just take numbers especially doe harvest.. it is the only reason behind AR's . Bow hunter think their satisfaction will decrease with more hunters in the wood.

They didn't want a youth hunt in their season even though guns are being used thru the entire season anyway for small game, with grouse and squirrel, turkey hunters being in the woods screwing up thier hunting much more than the few thousand youth hunters that go afield.

[phade]

Youth season will take place as last year from last I heard. People still aren't happy about it who were against it and people are who were for it, but its not being dropped from what I know via my contacts at the agency thus far.

[phade]

And, my crossbow arrived yesterday.

 

I haven't gotten around to shooting it yet. I feel dirty.

[Culvercreek hunt club]

And, my crossbow arrived yesterday.

 

I haven't gotten around to shooting it yet. I feel dirty.

You have officially slipped to the dark side.

[phade]

You have officially slipped to the dark side.

 

 

LOL. I've been around xbows for a while. When I lived in Virginia several club members used them and I got to shoot them alot. Plus, my FIL uses one when we go to Ohio.

 

I bought one more or less just for the sake of owning one. I can see myself using one on turkey (once legal) or when in a ground blind. For some reason, I get annoyed using my bow in a ground blind. Don't know why. Xbow will probably see action in those situations.

 

That and when going to Ohio with a buddy, this can serve as the back-up bow for both. Instead of bringing four bows (yes, I'm not getting caught with a busted bow and no hunting), we bring two and the xbow now, I guess.

Edited April 10, 2014 by phade

[Five Seasons]

That's all this really comes down to for people for or against it is hunter satisfaction. The DEC really doesn't seem to care about that to much just take numbers especially doe harvest.. it is the only reason behind AR's . Bow hunter think their satisfaction will decrease with more hunters in the wood.

They didn't want a youth hunt in their season even though guns are being used thru the entire season anyway for small game, with grouse and squirrel, turkey hunters being in the woods screwing up thier hunting much more than the few thousand youth hunters that go afield.

 

it's sad that the dec do not care about those that pay their salary. While I believe the inclusion of crossbows will not force any hunters to quit, I wonder what it does for the sport in years to come. When all we're concerned about is numbers, at some point hunters quit because they never see a nice buck. Or they go out of state. So if you lose the interest of those that pay to help control the herd, you  might end up with snipers in all of the state. I know it's extreme, but I just feel that sometimes people forget the license sales are what pay for the hatcheries, the parks, the trails and the land maintenance.

 

And just like anti-gun laws, at what point does it end? when do they just allow guns all the time to increase harvest numbers? How many on this forum would be ok with that too? because I imagine a lot of you who say "who cares what other hunters use" would be ok with guns too.

Edited April 10, 2014 by Belo

[G-Man]

dec salary if i remember correctly,is paid out of general fund same as troopers , or we could have more officers.enviromantal programs, enviromrntal cleanup, habitiat creation are from licence sales.. and as for not caring , their purpose is to control game and fish numbers. caring about someone getting a 165class buck is last on their list. plain and simple the general public wants less deer ruining their plants and cars... as for less hunters because the dont see big bucks, that happens now and will happen to new crossbowers who cant get close enought for a shot. if we as hunters dont do our part in reducing doe numbers to the point where seeing 3 together will make the news.. they will find other means to reduce numbers.. i kknow many hunters who get a doe tag and will not fill it.. now that we pay for them (i think this was put in place to kull those who wont shoot a doe) hopefully anterlass deer will be taken is what they hope for... i still think earn a buck or preference for next years doe tage should be based on success of previous tags being filled. i know 1 guy who gets his 2 tags every year. and sends them back like he got doe just so they stop issuing so many doe tags as he is against taking any doe. With people doing things like that no wonder our estimates are way off...

[nyantler]

The unwritten rule used to be that lesser weapons could be used in the seasons of the more effective weapons, but not the other way around. It looks like that rule of thumb or that kind of thinking no longer applies.

That rule was washed up with the inclusion of inline muzzleloaders to the primitive muzzleloader season years ago... and if we're honest, inclusion of the compound into archery season.

[sits in trees]

A couple of pointers for you new crossbow guys. When shooting keep you thumb down on your support hand, some bows actually have a shallow enough forend that will permit you to raise your thumb up high enough for the string to hit it on release, I removed half a thumbnail and quickly learned never to put that thumb up again.

Another biggie is a dryfire with a crossbow can not only be disastrous for the bow but you can do serious harm to any bystanders or yourself when the limbs fly off the bow at great speed like lawnmower blades spinning thru the air.

When relaxing the limbs on your bow always remove the arrow, duh sounds stupid right but you would not believe how many people have speared their foot into the ground with a crossbow arrow.

Another quickie, always use the manufacture's recommended arrows, unlike compound vert bows there's not much variation in arrow shaft weight/length that a crossbow will let you get away with without serious injury or mucho damage to the bow.

Also always be careful when cocking a crossbow they are like bear traps and if the string is not fully engaged and you let go your foot will be the first to know.

[nyslowhand]

Don't most mfgers strongly suggest (or insist) shooting an arrow to discharge a cocked Xbow???

 

FYI - Some mfgers have spec (fps/Ke) charts for specific Xbows using different arrow weights/composition from smaller diameter carbon to heavier aluminum arrows. Not disagreeing with above, but there is some choice. Arrow lengths are pre-determined by the geometry (draw length & stock) of a specific Xbow, usually ~20-22". More important is to get correct nocks per mfger's spec.

 

Good point about fingers getting near string path. Seen some models/mfgers supply plastic guards that get attached to stock to keep your fingers out of harm's way. Anyone still fuzzy about this, it can be related to compound bows with string suppressors. Put your finger/thumb on suppressor's pad and release string. Now make that 3X the force at ~170-180# draw wgt. Still not cringing....?

[sits in trees]

Yes many do suggest shooting to unload although a lot of hunters figure ways to bypass the dry fire mechanism by using a wooden dowel for example. Excalibur's are easily uncocked/unloaded with a rope cocker. My personal experience is that its a nuisance to have to shoot your xbow after a hunt especially at night, it requires you carry some sort of target to shoot into or walk back to your house in my situation with a cocked bow, all a little tricky at night. Also shooting an arrow into the ground to unload doesn't work here in upstate NY because you will be destroying arrows when they hit rocks buried in the dirt.

[nyslowhand]

You're right! Guess we both can agree that newbies must read & understand owner's manual before shooting! There are certain things that are general to all Xbows, but some mfgers have speicifics that vary greatly. So, know your weapon!

[Five Seasons]

 their purpose is to control game and fish numbers. caring about someone getting a 165class buck is last on their list. plain and simple the general public wants less deer ruining their plants and cars...

 

i do not disagree, but if you ignore the hunter looking for even the 130 class buck, he might just quit or go else where. So my point is that the DEC essentially gets money from hunters to help us control the population. It's not just a free service we provide them, but we actually pay to do it. If we have less hunters, they then have to pay snipers to do the controlling for them. There's a balance.