Proficiency - How good do you think you are?

[RoadKill44]

I don’t know if any standard method for measuring ones proficiency even exists.  If you know of one lets hear it. I know for guns hunters say they hold a such and such diameter pattern. But I'm asking about archery skills here.

 

One method I’ve seen, fires five consecutive arrows at a six inch diameter circle centered on a standard 8-1/2 X 11 sheet of paper.  As you move the paper back and forth down range, you must have all arrows on the page with four of those arrows inside the six inch ring. If you have no problems doing so at, let say 35 yards, that is the measurement of your proficiency.

 

Most 3D targets for deer have a ten ring about five inches in diameter.  So let’s also establish this scenario.  At what distance do you think you could release five arrows and consistently hit the ten spot of a standard 3D deer target given the allowance for no more than one arrow of the five scoring an eight.  

 

Now I’m not a sharpshooter and I haven’t done a test run myself.  I’m thinking 30 yards is doable. Having said that, I must now try and report back. I've taken deer at 40 yards but for me that's a reach and not a measurement of proficiency.

 

So here is the challenge. Let us know how good you think you are. Then using either the six inch circle on paper or standard 3D target report back your measured proficiency. Don't be afraid, be honest.

 

[The_Real_TCIII]

40 yards. I shoot a lot of 3D I'd be embarrassed if I missed. Having said that, 40 yards looks like a mile from a treestand

[wooly]

Well let me be the first to admit that I'm not the best bow shot by any stretch.

While I do well on paper out to 40yds, that doesn't always carry over into the field with me under hunting conditions.

 

I guess I'm one of the lazy bowhunters that doesn't have to time or desire to spend months pre-season preparing on paper or foam practicing long range shots.

For me at least, my proficiency with archery gear has increased by shrinking my personal maximum range on game drastically. That has translated to my bow never coming off the hook on what some here would consider slam dunk opportunities at 25yds and beyond.

I've learned that I'm ok with that, and will have to sacrifice a few shot opps every year because of it.

I've lost my share of deer over the years by trying to force shots I should have passed on or waited for them to close the distance. I've got a pretty good streak going these last 1/2 dozen seasons or so, and I see no reason to try to extend my range again.

[Nomad]

I'll give your test a try, but I generally don't shoot my bow till August or so....

If I can't keep 4 out of 5 arrows inside a 6 inch group my first try , I'll hang it up for good .

Had to pull this off my Instagram , these were my first 3 arrows of the year a couple season ago, 1 at 20,30 and 40 yards .

Edited March 31, 2016 by Larry302

[Rockspek]

I've only shot three bullets in my life.  One at a target, one through the lungs of a doe at maybe 20 yards and one through the lung of a buck at 10 yards.  I wait till they are close enough to be sure I can shoot them in the right spot or I don't shoot at all. And close enough for me is 10-20 yards

[Steve D]

I usually start shooting one to three times a week in mid to late Aug. primarily to

get the arms back & shoulders in shape. I have a foam bale and use balloons. I blow

them up to the size I want and stick 5 or 6 to the bale. I move the bale around after each round of shooting so I am never shooting the same distance or the same target(balloon)more than one

round.

I measure my proficiency on how many balloons I hit or how close I get to the

balloon. Once I am consistently hitting the balloon I blow them up smaller like 3-4" and practiceaway.

I also shoot off my deck which is 10-12 feet above the yard so it is almost like

shooting from a treestand...plus if it is hot I can have a toddy.

I blow the balloons up with a shot from the compressor to the desired diameter. By shooting at a different balloon every time it cuts down on damaged arrows, ripped fletching, broken knocks,

etc. and improves my accuracy.

I usually limit my shots to 25 yards or less because I find that over that I struggle hitting

the balloons consistently. I can hit them on a regular basis but not as often as I would like and as far as I am concerned 30+ yds. in the woods is a long shot with a bow.

Balloons are cheap and easy to pick up when I am done. Hardly ever shoot at ground level since most of my bow hunting is from a treestand.

[Nomad]

I like the way you practice Steve . I don't like shooting at the same spot either , to many damaged vanes and knocks. Where we differ is I see little change in poi from a stand or ground . The difference I see , and why I practice from a stand is the placement of feet on the Stand as opposed the the ground and drawing while backed against the tree .

Btw I have hunted Ontario county for close to 30 years , near the old Creekside gun shop, you close ?

[SteveB]

It is the first shot that counts for hunting proficiency - deer don't wait for you to shoot a group.

[Steve D]

Larry 302

Btw I have hunted Ontario county for close to 30 years , near the old Creekside gun

shop, you close ?

Not to far away...about 7 miles west in West Bloomfield. You have a pretty nice area to hunt. Has to be some bruisers that hang out there especially along that creek.

Boy I miss Creekside Gunshop...pretty pricey but always a nice place to go.

Edited April 1, 2016 by Steve D

[The_Real_TCIII]

[Steve D]

It is the first shot that counts for hunting proficiency - deer don't wait for you to shoot a group.

True the first shot counts...but if you can't shoot a group how can you be confident in that

"first" shot.

[SteveB]

By knowing that the 1st shot of the day and then the 1st of the following groups is on the mark.

Or you practise shooting one arrow at a time.

[Nomad]

I know a guy who only shoots one arrow per shooting session . Bow by back door , shoots when when he gets up, leaves for work, comes home and so on. His thing is it's easy to walk an arrow in after seeing where the first hits .

Like golf you get one drive, but guys go to a range mess up the first one then adjust and do better, but in reality that first one is the only one that counts.

[Culvercreek hunt club]

I've only shot three bullets in my life.  One at a target, one through the lungs of a doe at maybe 20 yards and one through the lung of a buck at 10 yards.  I wait till they are close enough to be sure I can shoot them in the right spot or I don't shoot at all. And close enough for me is 10-20 yards

10-20 yards with a gun?

[Curmudgeon]

I know a guy who only shoots one arrow per shooting session . Bow by back door , shoots when when he gets up, leaves for work, comes home and so on. His thing is it's easy to walk an arrow in after seeing where the first hits .

Like golf you get one drive, but guys go to a range mess up the first one then adjust and do better, but in reality that first one is the only one that counts.

 

When I bow hunted years ago, I would get in a groove shooting groups in July. Once tuned up I would shoot one arrow each day. I figured, if I could not be accurate with the first shot, the rest were wasted. That was pre-compound bow, no sights. When they required bow hunters to have a special class in the late 70s, I shot better with my recurve than every guy on the line who had a compound. At that time they were new. A lot has changed.

 

Being able to hit the target did not always translate into success in the field.

 

[Chris B]

I shoot in an "animal" league at Neil's Archery in Endicott in the winter and I'm fairly consistently the highest scorer on our team of 4. 12 weeks, 15 arrows each at 10, 15, & 20 yards and we shoot at paper targets with an illustration of an animal. Out of the 4 years I have done it we have taken 2 3rd place finishes, a 2nd place, and last year we won, beating out the team that usually wins every year with a staff shooter who shoots 5 league nights there Monday through Friday. I then shoot in august, September, and October...maybe 50 arrows/week. When I shoot at home, I shoot from 20-50 yards and I can group 3 arrows at a time within a 6" circle out to 50 yards with an occasional flyer outside that ring (at the 40-50 yard marks). I would like to think I am proficient but we all know shooting at paper and shooting at a deer are still two very different scenarios. Never had a chance to shoot at a buck (I have always passed does in archery but changed that this past season and never even saw a doe lol) that was stationary feeding; Have had to always try and stop each one to shoot. I know for a fact my proficiency decreases a good amount in the deer woods due to weather conditions, open shot opportunities, adrenaline, etc. To me, the best I can do to increase my proficiency is to keep shooting the league in the winter and then when I shoot at home, shoot many arrows out at 40+ yards. This way, when hunting, the idea is to have muscle memory help on the shot at a real animal and when I take my usual 12-25 yard shots, it looks like they are much closer! But of course, everyone has bad shots eventually. You are right, it is very difficult to measure proficiency. I never take my shooting for granted, always pushing to jam 3 arrows together at my furthest practice pin (50 yards). When I can shoot 3 arrows at 50 yards and robin hood every one, I will tell you I am very proficient.

[Carbonelement]

i would bring my bow to the bow shop if I shot 5 arrows and there was a 6 inch grouping at anything under 45 yards.  I expect the arrows to be touching at that distance and if not i would think there was a major issue.  

 

It blows my mind that someone thinks if they can hit a pie plate they are ready for the woods.  I see it in archery shops all the time people "sighting in" with  5-8 inch groups and thinking all is well.  

 

At 20 yards (most indoor ranges) the shots should be touching fletchings no ifs ands or butts! I could see if it was user error on one out of 10 shots. but if all the other shots are not that close I believe the person has no business in the woods.

[grampy]

Even with bad shoulders, I still shoot 15 to 20 arrows, minimum every week, year round. It's use it or lose it at this point for me. Using my old MQ-32, I can still consistently put five arrows in a six inch circle, out to 30 yards. That is my maximum hunting distance. But I can no longer hold full draw longer than a few seconds.

 

After a few clean misses and a deer shot and not recovered, I learned a long time ago. That I'm never as good I think I am. So I strive to be as good as I can be.

[SteveB]

At 20 yards (most indoor ranges) the shots should be touching fletchings no ifs ands or butts!

I could see if it was user error on one out of 10 shots. but if all the other shots are not that

close I believe the person has no business in the woods.

Arrows touching at 20 yards is a 60X 300 perfect score on a NFAA round.

Are you saying that should be the minimum for hunting?

[dbHunterNY]

I've shot rifles all my life.  I can and have confidently take grazing deer at out to 320 yards while sitting with a unattached bipod to rest nothing bigger than a 30-06.  I have lost deer but not in a long time and both were within 100 yards. 

 

took two coyote pups with 1 shot each at a paced off 250ish yards.  2nd was on the run right after the first was shot and was rested on a treestand rail.  I hunt woodchucks during the spring and summer.  taken well over a hundred out past 250 yards with almost all my shots sitting with an attached bipod.  rarely ever do I miss chucks.  they do give you a lot more time, I'm setup well, and shooting the most accurate and stable rifle I've got though.

 

archery I shoot a lot.  shoot a lot more outdoor 3D's.  during competition over the summer and leading up to fall i'll shoot 8's (vitals) at times, but a vast majority are 10 or 11s (heart or dead center).  within IBO ranges 35 yards max my average is over 300 out of 330 (30 targets).  I don't shoot open so it's basically a hunting bow setup.  haven't lost a deer yet with a bow.  missed once from a branch deflection when I started bowhunting.  haven't since.  average yardage I shoot deer with a bow is about 25 yards.

 

...is that proficient?  compared to what?  you tell me.

[RoadKill44]

There are slight differences between indoor and outdoor range shooting but a couple of comments address the fact that field situations are far different. An adrenaline high can do all sorts of crazy stuff to the mind and body. Being a gun hunter for 50 years, before picking up the bow for the last six years, presents a hurdle to think about judging distance prior to release. The practice through attending 3D shoots has helped and it doesn't seem to be a issue now.

 

Some of you also mentioned the first shot being the most important shot. I've never tried it but I like the "One shot per session" method of training concept. No warm up practice or monitoring sacrifice shots. The take aim and shoot is all you have when the game shows itself. Another practice I do while hunting is to practice draw. I may be a blind or stand where I plan to stay for a time. The practice draws at various objects give you a feel for your range of good shot locations and it doesn't hurt to provide muscle activity in cold weather.

 

Other factors coming into play when measuring your skill level is bow tuning and arrow consistency. One surprise discovery I found was using a glow nock for the first time. The glow nock worked the nuts but I happen to notice my shots were consistently three inches low while the other arrows were spot on. H'mm? got the grain scale out and found the glow nock was 30gns heavier. Wow! That little 30gn difference dropped my arrow speed by 7%, resulting in the 3 inch drop at 30 yard difference.

 

Back to the thread. My initial goal was to see if there was any standard way to measure proficiency and suggest a challenge to some sort of standard method by which we could judge ourselves. To compare how good we think we are with how good we really are. I allude to the comment "I'm never as good I think I am. So I strive to be as good as I can be." I liked that.  

 

 

Edited April 1, 2016 by RoadKill44

[stoneam2006]

I'm good enough to kill deer and the occasional squirrel from a treestand 35 and under....that's my Guage...I shoot quite a bit come Aug Sept and always feel more than comfortable heading into woods

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[The_Real_TCIII]

There was a thread on AT where guys went outside in the morning and fired one shot at 30 or whatever and posted a pic. We should do that come August

[stoneam2006]

There was a thread on AT where guys went outside in the morning and fired one shot at 30 or whatever and posted a pic. We should do that come August

I'm in

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[ncountry]

I average around 290 shooting indoor... I would have to admit to being a lot better shooting at a target than at a deer..lol