Don't shoot the messenger...

[silent death]

Active scrapes already here in 4s ...if it stays cold opening week of rifle could be interesting 

[Buckstopshere]

Not surprising at all to see what we call "early breeding." Not early to the deer, just their way. A few doe will always cycle earlier than the rest, and that is why we see an early fawn in early May during gobbler season. Just like a few doe will cycle later than the rest, and we see late action in December and January. Right now  is the "first rut" and should peak this year next week this year around the full moon. But most does in our neck of the woods will be breeding about a month later which we call the peak of the rut, and then a month following, during the second week of December, the "post rut" will hit. That sequence (three rut peaks) think bell curves, happens every year, just at slightly different times, skewed by about two weeks. Next week, things should heat up, then drop off again as the first rut peak hits. But all along the way, once in a while a doe will cycle...at any time. But it is the exception. And when we speak of "the rut peak" it is a generality.

[Culvercreek hunt club]

No but I did stay at a holiday Inn last night....lol

 

Monday night I had 4 bucks parade by my stand at 10 yards. two 4's and tow small 6's. All in a group and they did chase around one young doe for about 5 minutes before she got fed up and bolted. 

[Culvercreek hunt club]

13 hours ago, Geno C said:

 

not uncommon to see smaller scrub buck exercising doe around this time of year... i was giving it another week or less to start hearing about it. smaller buck start feeling their oats a little early. ive got one on cam that looked like he was scooting in on a doe a few days ago. 

 

those doe arent even close tho this early, but it doesn stop those smaller buck pushing em up

College freshman chasing girls at 9 pm and the Seniors waiting until closing time. 

[WNYBuckHunter]

I have pics on cam of young bucks bumping does around, sparring, etc for the last 3 or 4 weeks. Last week was the first time I got any pics of a mature buck sparring yet. This happens every year at this time. The young guys just get excited early.

[LET EM GROW]

I got a trail cam pic of a young buck mounting a doe couple weeks ago. But her head was down and she was feeding the whole time in every pic. So i think he had no idea what he was even doing. lol his head was stuck in her a$$, if he wasn't already trying to get on top of her..  Dont think any breeding actually took place. He's probably the does offspring from the year before lol. Scummer.. 

Some sparring in pics here and there..

[dbHunterNY]

4 hours ago, Culvercreek hunt club said:

College freshman chasing girls at 9 pm and the Seniors waiting until closing time. 

this is a really good analogy.  time of peak breeding doesn't change much year to year.  rutting activity observed can.  it's possible that doe are getting bred right now but they are very very few and far between.

[Four Season Whitetail's]

Way to early yet. The youngsters may be messing around feeling their oat's.  The scrapes you see now will not be so called..Active..but more so as the more dominate buck in the area starting to mark a little here and there. Give it another 20 some days and all bets are off. One could explode at any time.

[LET EM GROW]

Here's a thought for everyone. This is a friend's cam. He lives in PA and the date is correct. When do you think she was bred?

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[chrisw]

Probably the second estrous cycle in January but who knows. That is a little fella!

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[LET EM GROW]

I'm thinking January or later when she got bred. Fawn in is several months the behind it seems

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[Buckstopshere]

Gestation period for a doe is 200 days give or take a few. That fawn (if the date on the camera is correct. My cameras change their dates a lot. No knock on the manufacturers. But I don't trust them and always check if it makes sense.) Rule of thumb five months from conception to fawn drop. An April conception date is pretty farfetched...I only have one buck in hardhorn on camera in April. And that was just one horn, April 1st. I would sooner think the date on the camera is skewed...either the machine or the human error.

[LET EM GROW]

That's the first thing I said about this being farfetched. But he just pulled the card from this camera last week. I've had several bucks hold headgear into early april before but.. not often. I'm sure if she randomly came into heat, I'd like to think a buck can be ready to "plant the seed" at anytime. Though I could be wrong, just a guess on my part

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[Rockspek]

9 minutes ago, LET EM GROW said:

That's the first thing I said about this being farfetched. But he just pulled the card from this camera last week. I've had several bucks hold headgear into early april before but.. not often. I'm sure if she randomly came into heat, I'd like to think a buck can be ready to "plant the seed" at anytime. Though I could be wrong, just a guess on my part

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definitely extreme but I'd believe that 

[Buckstopshere]

Buck's testosterone and other hormones drop pretty significantly in February, March and April according to researchers. Not only do they drop their horns as evidence, but they shed their winter coats, and actually begin the process of antler growth. Is it possible that a fawn hit the ground in early September...? in New York?, sure. But highly unlikely. I would sooner think it is a camera dating error as more likely.

[Geno C]

12 hours ago, Culvercreek hunt club said:

College freshman chasing girls at 9 pm and the Seniors waiting until closing time. 

exactly... lol

the smaller buck always do this this time of year, without fail... I dont think guys should over look this and get excited and start flooding to the woods over it. Its normal..

[LET EM GROW]

Buck's testosterone and other hormones drop pretty significantly in February, March and April according to researchers. Not only do they drop their horns as evidence, but they shed their winter coats, and actually begin the process of antler growth. Is it possible that a fawn hit the ground in early September...? in New York?, sure. But highly unlikely. I would sooner think it is a camera dating error as more likely.

I completely agree with you 100% but, I again spoke with him last night. He pulled the card from that camera in the end of September. Just as he programmed the date and time for reference when checking. I never would have believed it either but. I personally know this man, as he owns property next door to my piece, but lives in PA. Otherwise I wouldn't believe it.

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[growalot]

Avon NY many years ago...driving the back road that comes out on 5/20 just above Avons DEC offices.

First week of April, a huge 8 or 10 stood plain as day in a pasture near a barn, not all that far from where the gravel plant is.  So big that I backed the car up to make sure he,was real...He watched me watching him then trotted over and jumped the fence.. I have no doubt that buck was still capable of breeding a doe.

Edited October 6, 2016 by growalot

[Buckstopshere]

38 minutes ago, growalot said:

Avon NY many years ago...driving the back road that comes out on 5/20 just above Avons DEC offices.

First week of April, a huge 8 or 10 stood plain as day in a pasture near a barn, not all that far from where the gravel plant is.  So big that I backed the car up to make sure he,was real...He watched me watching him then trotted over and jumped the fence.. I have no doubt that buck was still capable of breeding a doe.

Great thing about studying nature and this wonderful mystery of the whitetail is that we learn new things that are outside what we consider "normal." And as we get older...ahem...like yours truly, our views tend to calcify and it is tougher to accept new things even though it is reality. I hope I can always learn...it is just that I also am suspicious of our technology. Nature resists being put in a box...there seems to always be exceptions.

Edited October 6, 2016 by Buckstopshere

[nyantler]

Anyone that thinks they know everything about whitetails... doesn't know much about whitetails.

 

[NFA-ADK]

I have to agree this is normal, young bucks just can't help themselves.  Plus you can have doe come into heat now, like stated this is the first cycle, (Or the start of it.)  another month or so and the 2nd then same in Dec with November as the prime rut. 

All it takes is one doe in heat to get that testosterone going not much else to do but eat fight and chase tail.  Why not start early they have nothing better to do!