School me on portable generators

[The_Real_TCIII]

14 minutes ago, Belo said:

i've thought about this too. unfortunately the south facing side of my home is the front. Was it reversed i'd probably go solar. 

Ive thought about this for my house too I have a large expanse of roof facing West. Theres a church by me that has them on the South and East, and theyve got huge slopes in all four directions to choose from. (Im now realizing theyre mostly southern exposures but leaving the pic because its interesting lol)

 

[52 farmer]

On 4/5/2018 at 2:39 PM, Belo said:

What size and brand do you recommend for a house to cover fridge, 13 cubic foot stand up freezer, furnace and led lighting? house is 2.3k and can be run at low temps but enough not to freeze the kids. Furnace isn't mandatory because I can burn wood if it would make a substantial price difference, but would be nice.

Also, what is a fair price for an electrician to install a back feed? 

2008 i bought a 8000/13500 generator, had a electrican hook me into the main box. It ran me around $1400 for generator, labor and parts.It was $3500 for a whole house at the time ,wish i would of went that route.

I got a quote last year for a whole house 2200sq ft. it was $8800,cant justify spending that much money now.

Just went 4 days with power out, had to use generator, fill with gas every 9-10 hrs.Battery for electric start quit lucky easy to pull start, even with me being on crutches nursing a broken foot.

I f you can afford a whole house go for it ,you will never regret it.

[philoshop]

On 4/7/2018 at 7:47 AM, wolc123 said:

 

They may but I don't.  My last straw on those was when I tried to use my dad's battery-operated drill to put in a pilot hole and a lag bolt into a hard maple tree to support a blind over at my folks place about 5 years ago.  Naturally, the battery was not up to the task and they had no charged spare at the house.   I found an antique hand crank brace and bit out in the barn and used that to get the job done.    I have a few plug in electric drill motors that are probably from the 1950's and still work as good as they did when new.   Batteries might be handy when you are in a house or shop with some spares and a charger but not so much out in the woods or back in a field.     

Try a decent battery-powered tool, like a Milwaulkee, and you'll be surprised. The $50 Ryobi is always going to disappoint you, but a good-quality tool is worth it. I have several friends in the construction industry who are almost 100% battery-operated now, and they have no regrets. They take care of their batteries, and they don't have to carry around generators and extension cords. The roofers tend to use gas-powered compressors because you just never know what the integrity of the house circuit is.

[Hunter007]

1 hour ago, Belo said:

i've thought about this too. unfortunately the south facing side of my home is the front. Was it reversed i'd probably go solar. 

To bad maybe they have a solution for that you would  have to talk to them .

Another thing good about  solar is NO noise .

My neighbor has generator backup system it  makes  a racket when its on .

 

Edited April 9, 2018 by Storm914

[Five Seasons]

2 hours ago, Storm914 said:

To bad maybe they have a solution for that you would  have to talk to them .

Another thing good about  solar is NO noise .

My neighbor has generator backup system it  makes  a racket when its on .

 

i'm vary familiar with it. My dad's cabin in the Adirondacks is 100% solar fed. I would have to sacrifice aesthetics or my whole back yard (just .75 acres) and i'm not really willing to do it. 

Edited April 9, 2018 by Belo

[fasteddie]

I paid over $10,000 for my whole house generator . Power went out at least 3 times last year .... at least that's what my neighbors told me . WE had lights , heat , tv , computer , sump pump operating etc.. Gave me peace of mind when going on any vacations which made it worth it .

[Adkhunter1590]

i'm vary familiar with it. My dad's cabin in the Adirondacks is 100% solar fed. I would have to sacrifice aesthetics or my whole back yard (just .75 acres) and i'm not really willing to do it. 

Ground mount units don’t take up that much space. My system is grid tied and doesn’t do anything for me in a power outage but if I wanted to install a battery bank then I’d be able to power the house during outages. I didn’t see the point of spending the extra many thousands on battery bank when we already have the propane standby generac installed.


I can’t remember the exact dimensions but the panels take up about 20ft by 30ft roughly. I only have a acre lot so like you I was concerned about how much space they would take up but once they showed me how little space it was, I was much happier. Haven’t paid a electric bill since being installed.

[Lawdwaz]

I'm just going to reiterate a simple point that I'm SURE was posted earlier.......with a portable generator, you need to be home to run it.  It is useless if you are on vacation, could be difficult for your wife to start and if not maintained properly.  A "whole house" generator eliminates many of these worries.  The fact that they do a self test once a week lessens the chance of it not working when needed.  

Portable generator is my choice now but I can see someday soon going with the WH unit.

YMMV

[CoffeeBoy]

If you're going to depend on a whole house automatic generator, then the once a week 12 minute exercise cycle isn't enough. It needs to be tested under a full load, minimum of once a month for 30 min or so. So every few weeks, shut off your main breaker, and make sure everything happens as it's supposed to: generator starts, transfer switch operates, generator takes the load without bogging down, transfer switch operates when it senses return of utility power (after you turn the main back on), generator runs it's cool down cycle and shuts off.

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[chas0218]

22 hours ago, Belo said:

yeah but I think they average around $5-$6k. that's a lot compared to a $700 portable and a switch... but I agree the best solution.

Are you handy? I would buy a 5.5k watt or somewhere around that and buy one of those fuel conversion "tri-fuel" kits that allow you to run it on natural gas, propane, or gasoline. They are about $200 on ebay and quality kits (link below). All you would need to do is find the kit that fits the generator you're planning on buying. I am going to be purchasing one for my house. As of right now I don't have natural gas but according to the town it in in the works in the next 5 years, about 1/2 mile down the road is natural gas. I currently have gas stove and fuel oil furnace so I will be running a propane line for the generator. One thing I would look into is a power/line conditioner to allow you to run sensitive electronics. The line conditioner listed would be good enough for a wireless router, Large flat screen TV, cable modem and DVR. It would also double as a surge protector.

https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_trksid=p2386202.m570.l1311.R4.TR8.TRC2.A0.H0.Xtri+fue.TRS0&_nkw=tri+fuel+conversion+kit&_sacat=0

Line Conditioner:

https://www.amazon.com/APC-LE1200-Automatic-Voltage-Regulator/dp/B00009RA60/ref=pd_cp_23_1?_encoding=UTF8&pd_rd_i=B00009RA60&pd_rd_r=1RJXG5E1HSW2YNX6D9XQ&pd_rd_w=kVMab&pd_rd_wg=qVK5p&psc=1&refRID=1RJXG5E1HSW2YNX6D9XQ

Edited April 10, 2018 by chas0218

[chas0218]

22 hours ago, philoshop said:

Try a decent battery-powered tool, like a Milwaulkee, and you'll be surprised. The $50 Ryobi is always going to disappoint you, but a good-quality tool is worth it. I have several friends in the construction industry who are almost 100% battery-operated now, and they have no regrets. They take care of their batteries, and they don't have to carry around generators and extension cords. The roofers tend to use gas-powered compressors because you just never know what the integrity of the house circuit is.

@wolc123 I agree, I have the cheap porter cables and although they work I hate how fast they die. I abuse them and get about 2 or 3 years out of the tools themselves at that point I just toss the whole tool and batteries. I have some older 18V ni-cad porter cables that won't seem to die but get a lot less use. I would recommend the rigid, or milwaukee drill driver sets. The Dewalts have become junk we use them here at work for light use woodworking and the Hitachi drill driver sets last longer and are half the price.

Edited April 10, 2018 by chas0218

[airedale]

The first thing is do not cheap out, you will get what you pay for.

I have a mid priced Northern Tool 5500W generator, the gas motor that runs it is a Honda which I personally believe is very important. It is pull start and will usually start on the second or third pull. It is heavy so it needs the wheel and handle kit installed in order to be able to move it around easily. The current model runs around $1200 with the wheel kit, it is a high quality generator

I have a 6 line transfer box that was installed by an electrician, it it mounted on a wall in my cellar next to my main service panel and is hooked up to the the most important circuits that I need to have powered. The transfer switch box is around $350.00 so final cost would be determined by how much your electrician would charge you to install but the total should be under $2000.00

This setup works perfectly for my needs and has been totally reliable for many years, use non ethanol gas, change the oil and plug when needed and you will be good to go.

The diagram below is pretty much the exact way mine is installed.

Al

Edited April 10, 2018 by airedale

[chas0218]

1 hour ago, airedale said:

The first thing is do not cheap out, you will get what you pay for.

I have a mid priced Northern Tool 5500W generator, the gas motor that runs it is a Honda which I personally believe is very important. It is pull start and will usually start on the second or third pull. It is heavy so it needs the wheel and handle kit installed in order to be able to move it around easily. The current model runs around $1200 with the wheel kit, it is a high quality generator

I have a 6 line transfer box that was installed by an electrician, it it mounted on a wall in my cellar next to my main service panel and is hooked up to the the most important circuits that I need to have powered. The transfer switch box is around $350.00 so final cost would be determined by how much your electrician would charge you to install but the total should be under $2000.00

This setup works perfectly for my needs and has been totally reliable for many years, use non ethanol gas, change the oil and plug when needed and you will be good to go.

The diagram below is pretty much the exact way mine is installed.

Al

This works but an interlock for an updated panel is easier and much cheaper.

Basically with an interlock it forces the homeowner to shut off the main breaker then allows you to backfeed through a double pole single throw breaker. You can pick and choose which circuits you want on based on the configuration of your breaker panel. If you want the easy route you can just run extension cords to your appliances.

Edited April 10, 2018 by chas0218

[airedale]

Yes that is a good setup but for my place it will not work too well as my meter is on a pole about 600 ft from my house.

Al

[Jeremy K]

4 hours ago, Adkhunter1590 said:

 

Ground mount units don’t take up that much space. My system is grid tied and doesn’t do anything for me in a power outage but if I wanted to install a battery bank then I’d be able to power the house during outages. I didn’t see the point of spending the extra many thousands on battery bank when we already have the propane standby generac installed.


I can’t remember the exact dimensions but the panels take up about 20ft by 30ft roughly. I only have a acre lot so like you I was concerned about how much space they would take up but once they showed me how little space it was, I was much happier. Haven’t paid a electric bill since being installed.

 

I'm digging that crf , my little guy is almost ready for one .

[Adkhunter1590]

I'm digging that crf , my little guy is almost ready for one .

The boys love it. The yard is almost dry enough now that they will be able to ride again. They have been very patient but they really want to get back out there. I’m sure it’s going to get a lot of use this summer!

[WNYBuckHunter]

On 4/9/2018 at 3:14 PM, Belo said:

i'm vary familiar with it. My dad's cabin in the Adirondacks is 100% solar fed. I would have to sacrifice aesthetics or my whole back yard (just .75 acres) and i'm not really willing to do it. 

Tesla solar roof. You cant really tell that they are there

[Hunter007]

13 hours ago, Adkhunter1590 said:

 

Ground mount units don’t take up that much space. My system is grid tied and doesn’t do anything for me in a power outage but if I wanted to install a battery bank then I’d be able to power the house during outages. I didn’t see the point of spending the extra many thousands on battery bank when we already have the propane standby generac installed.


I can’t remember the exact dimensions but the panels take up about 20ft by 30ft roughly. I only have a acre lot so like you I was concerned about how much space they would take up but once they showed me how little space it was, I was much happier. Haven’t paid a electric bill since being installed.

 

I don't think the solar  panels look bad In a yard actually but the wind farms really piss me off can't stand seeing those things . 

[Adkhunter1590]

I don't think the solar  panels look bad In a yard actually but the wind farms really piss me off can't stand seeing those things . 

I agree. The wind farms are a true eye sore. Not to mention hazardous in multiple ways.

I also like that my ground panels double as a roof for storing things under. I have a bit of firewood stacked under it and a lawn roller and a few other little outdoor things I wanted to keep out of the snow.

[Five Seasons]

Ground mount units don’t take up that much space. My system is grid tied and doesn’t do anything for me in a power outage but if I wanted to install a battery bank then I’d be able to power the house during outages. I didn’t see the point of spending the extra many thousands on battery bank when we already have the propane standby generac installed.


I can’t remember the exact dimensions but the panels take up about 20ft by 30ft roughly. I only have a acre lot so like you I was concerned about how much space they would take up but once they showed me how little space it was, I was much happier. Haven’t paid a electric bill since being installed.

Interesting. Do you have website info I can look into?


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[Five Seasons]

Are you handy? I would buy a 5.5k watt or somewhere around that and buy one of those fuel conversion "tri-fuel" kits that allow you to run it on natural gas, propane, or gasoline. They are about $200 on ebay and quality kits (link below). All you would need to do is find the kit that fits the generator you're planning on buying. I am going to be purchasing one for my house. As of right now I don't have natural gas but according to the town it in in the works in the next 5 years, about 1/2 mile down the road is natural gas. I currently have gas stove and fuel oil furnace so I will be running a propane line for the generator. One thing I would look into is a power/line conditioner to allow you to run sensitive electronics. The line conditioner listed would be good enough for a wireless router, Large flat screen TV, cable modem and DVR. It would also double as a surge protector.
https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_trksid=p2386202.m570.l1311.R4.TR8.TRC2.A0.H0.Xtri+fue.TRS0&_nkw=tri+fuel+conversion+kit&_sacat=0
Line Conditioner:
https://www.amazon.com/APC-LE1200-Automatic-Voltage-Regulator/dp/B00009RA60/ref=pd_cp_23_1?_encoding=UTF8&pd_rd_i=B00009RA60&pd_rd_r=1RJXG5E1HSW2YNX6D9XQ&pd_rd_w=kVMab&pd_rd_wg=qVK5p&psc=1&refRID=1RJXG5E1HSW2YNX6D9XQ

I’m handy, but a little concerned with tapping into city gas...


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[Five Seasons]

I agree. The wind farms are a true eye sore. Not to mention hazardous in multiple ways.

I also like that my ground panels double as a roof for storing things under. I have a bit of firewood stacked under it and a lawn roller and a few other little outdoor things I wanted to keep out of the snow.

Can’t be worse than the smoke from a coal plant...


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[BizCT]

Ask Biz lol 

Cheaper to go on a nice vacation once a year


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[Adkhunter1590]

Interesting. Do you have website info I can look into?


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We used Monolith for our solar install. https://monolithsolar.com

Have zero complaints about them. I think we only had to put $250 down and the rest was financed through a company they deal with that does NYSERDA solar loans. I’m paying about $40-50 less per month than the average electric bill was for this house over the last 5 years. They will have you get your electric bill records from the electric company, see how many Kw you used and how much you paid per month and base your system size off of that information. The other advantage to ground mount systems is that they can usually get away with using a few less panels, thus reducing the cost a tad because they can position the panels at just the right angles to provide the best performance vs being limited to how your roof is setup.

If you did decide to go with solar and monolith at some point, PM me. If you use my info as a referral, I would get $500 and you’d also get the same amount off if I remember correctly. Same goes for you after your install, any friends or family members that decide to install with them, you’d get a check for $500. Not a bad deal for everyone involved!

[Adkhunter1590]

Can’t be worse than the smoke from a coal plant...


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True....unless one blew up and lit your house on fire. When they go up in flames they tend to shower down sparks and burn up everything around them. Like this...