Al Bundy

16 gauge.. someone school me

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My only exposure to a 16 was many years ago. I always thought 16 had a bit more knockdown power and range than a 20. But I just ASSUMED this. A 16 is being contemplated for a young female huntress primarily for ducks.  Some possibility for snows/canadas.  Comments??? Opinions?? 

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The biggest issue with 16 gauge would be ammo availability (in steel or non-toxic) and ammo cost.  .410, 28, 16 are much more expensive to shoot (like almost double the cost) since they only run limited runs of shells.

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Rack hit it on the head. I would evaluate whether she can shoot a 12. 12 gauge target loads do not have a heavy recoil for practice and I'd stick with 2-3/4" for hunting until she is more comfortable before you consider 3".  I firmly believe a hunter never really notices the recoil in a situation where they are shooting at game. 

Edited by Culvercreek hunt club
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"Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote." -- Benjamin Franklin

"The trouble with Socialism is, sooner or later you run out of other people's money." - Margaret Thatcher

"When you subsidize poverty and failure, you get more of both.." - James Dale Davidson, National Taxpayers Union

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let me add that if she is considering using it for deer I would certainly stick with the 20 or 12. 


"Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote." -- Benjamin Franklin

"The trouble with Socialism is, sooner or later you run out of other people's money." - Margaret Thatcher

"When you subsidize poverty and failure, you get more of both.." - James Dale Davidson, National Taxpayers Union

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My daughter is a very small build and we had a 870 youth cut down even further and use lighter loads.

With a 12 gas. there is no shortage of options for any game or target....

First and foremost get a shotgun that "fits" her well....

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I have a 1957 Browning Sweet16  that was handed down from father.   I use this gun more than any other of my other (4) 12ga and (2) 20 ga.   Spectacular rabbit. grouse, goose gun.  I also use for deer with the Federal  Power-Shok slug 2/34 "  1600 fps.   Hit a deer in the neck and they flip.  The slug ammo is approx  $5.50 a box.   I would not have any hesitation  recommending the 16ga.   

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My first real hunting gun purchased for me by my Dad was a Mossberg 16 ga three shot bolt action with an adjustable choke. While on the clunky side for handling and style I shot it well and took a ton of small game with that gun. A 16 ga shotgun found in a style and action you like and learned how to shoot well will be no handicap when it comes to taking game. I have long been considering getting a 16 in a side by side or over and under, just waiting for the right one to come along.

Al

Edited by airedale
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Serious Dogs For Serious Work

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.410 shell with # 8 shot, 12 gauge shell loaded with #8 shot, both produce a velocity of 1,100 Feet Per Second, pellet energy is exactley the same. The .410 is 1/2 oz. shot, 12 gauge is 1 oz. simple

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I am a big fan of the 16 gauge for upland game and have owned several....The first few seasons I hunted ducks I used

 a Rem 11-48  in 16 gauge, and it worked fine..But that was with lead shot...

Now that we are limited  to using non-toxic shot, you are barking up the wrong tree with the 16 for waterfowl...….

Load selection is very limited for the 16...Much more than for the 20 gauge, which is also a poor choice for waterfowl with non-toxic loads.

The best gun for her would be a gas operated 12 gauge auto..Second best a recoil operated 12 gauge auto...Third best a 12 gauge pump ….Recoil with 2 3/4"  non toxic loads will not be overwhelming, and as Culver says, when shooting at game most people don't notice recoil as much...There are many inexpensive  light  kicking loads available for the young lady to use for shooting clays or other target practice, and many of them are effective on small game as well...

 

 

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The problem is not felt recoil during shooting. The problem is felt recoil for 3 or so days AFTER shooting.  I was thinking about all this and I do not know what 12 gauge gun and what load she shot to hurt her shoulder so much after. I do have some target 12 gauge 2 3/4 in  she could try through a few of the 12s that are around.   

I feel a bit bad for her. Her father is not taking any interest, though hes a big deer hunter.  The two times she sat in the blind she didn't even load/pickup the 12. Told me she really wanted to shoot the ducks but couldnt bring herself to due to the pain she has to endure after. I feel somewhat in charge of teaching her  and I think her shooting the 12 will  have negative consequences for long term. IE - sour her on shooting totally.

 I have two 20's laying around and barring finding a reasonably priced 16 with some miracle duck load, its looking like a 20 is going to be it.  Hevi shot makes a 2 3/4in no lead shot I am thinking of buying and running through the Ithaca I have around.  I know not the best choice but under the circumstances maybe best..???

I appreciate all comments here and ultimately she will as well.. Keep them coming.

 

 

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2 hours ago, Al Bundy said:

The problem is not felt recoil during shooting. The problem is felt recoil for 3 or so days AFTER shooting.  I was thinking about all this and I do not know what 12 gauge gun and what load she shot to hurt her shoulder so much after. I do have some target 12 gauge 2 3/4 in  she could try through a few of the 12s that are around.   

I feel a bit bad for her. Her father is not taking any interest, though hes a big deer hunter.  The two times she sat in the blind she didn't even load/pickup the 12. Told me she really wanted to shoot the ducks but couldnt bring herself to due to the pain she has to endure after. I feel somewhat in charge of teaching her  and I think her shooting the 12 will  have negative consequences for long term. IE - sour her on shooting totally.

 I have two 20's laying around and barring finding a reasonably priced 16 with some miracle duck load, its looking like a 20 is going to be it.  Hevi shot makes a 2 3/4in no lead shot I am thinking of buying and running through the Ithaca I have around.  I know not the best choice but under the circumstances maybe best..???

I appreciate all comments here and ultimately she will as well.. Keep them coming.

 

 

Honestly if she is that recoil shy of the 12 the 16 will not be a noticeable difference and I would put her in a an auto loading 20 until she gains more experience. 

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"Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote." -- Benjamin Franklin

"The trouble with Socialism is, sooner or later you run out of other people's money." - Margaret Thatcher

"When you subsidize poverty and failure, you get more of both.." - James Dale Davidson, National Taxpayers Union

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I love my 16gauge wish you could find them more often or i would have 10.  Mines really low recoil and is geeat for bird hunting.  Mines in retirement now was my grandpas,uncles,my fathers now mine so its been shot alot.  But biggest issue is ammo,not alot of people have it and if they do its not a big variety. 

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My grandad's old16 gauge Ithaca model 37 kicks like a mule but it has brought down every deer that I have shot it at, since I mounted a 1.5X Weaver scope on it back around 1983.    I only hunted with my dad's Browning sweet 16 one time, but I went two for two on ruffed grouse on that hunt, and they were both difficult shots.   Those experiences have made the 16 gauge number one for me.   I also think the looks and proportions are just right.  The barrels on the 20's look too skinny and 12's look too fat.   The only downside is the ammo cost and availability.   No big deal for me though.  At the rate I am using them, I should have an easy lifetime's supply of 16 gauge Remington sluggers, that I picked up for 20 cents each.

    

Here is this year's handiwork: 

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On 12/3/2019 at 5:07 PM, Culvercreek hunt club said:

Honestly if she is that recoil shy of the 12 the 16 will not be a noticeable difference and I would put her in a an auto loading 20 until she gains more experience. 

An Ithaca 37   20   with heavy loads kicks like a demon....Much worse that a gas operated 12 gauge auto..My ex-wife had a 20 gauge Deerslayer and I dreaded sighting it in with slugs from the bench...I swapped it for a Rem 1100 LT-20....MUCH  less abusive...  The 1100  was only about a pound heavier than the Ithaca,  but  the extra pound plus the gas operation made it a real pussycat to shoot...

I also suspect that the young lady might need some coaching on shooting form, especially proper gun mounting...If she has the butt too far out on her shoulder or too close to her collarbone, rather than in the "pocket" in between, even a light kicking gun is going to bruise her..

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7 minutes ago, Pygmy said:

An Ithaca 37   20   with heavy loads kicks like a demon....Much worse that a gas operated 12 gauge auto..My ex-wife had a 20 gauge Deerslayer and I dreaded sighting it in with slugs from the bench...I swapped it for a Rem 1100 LT-20....MUCH  less abusive...  The 1100  was only about a pound heavier than the Ithaca,  but  the extra pound plus the gas operation made it a real pussycat to shoot...

I also suspect that the young lady might need some coaching on shooting form, especially proper gun mounting...If she has the butt too far out on her shoulder or too close to her collarbone, rather than in the "pocket" in between, even a light kicking gun is going to bruise her..

Fit on those guns makes all the difference in the world. She may be better suited with a youth configuration in the stocks. I have a Winchester 1400 in 20 with a pretty short vented rib barrel. That thing was a bit small for me but made a good close cover gun when I was training my Springer on grouse. It is only chambered in 2-3/4 but is a pussycat to shoot.  Dad had a Deer slayer in 12 when I was young. I had NO desire to shoot that the second time...lol. But his 1100 I loved to shoot. 


"Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote." -- Benjamin Franklin

"The trouble with Socialism is, sooner or later you run out of other people's money." - Margaret Thatcher

"When you subsidize poverty and failure, you get more of both.." - James Dale Davidson, National Taxpayers Union

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Thanks so far. Yes she does need some help on shooting form. I noticed when she shot the 20 she looked awkward and uncomfortable.

That 20 is a Remington 11-870  BTW.  The other is Ithaca featherlight.  Ithaca has not been shot since the late 80's.   The Ithaca with bird shot is a bitch to shoot? I honestly don't think I ever shot it. It was Dads duck gun in the lead shot days. I actually went along to purchase this at Creekside in 1979. Damn... takes me back.

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27 minutes ago, Al Bundy said:

That 20 is a Remington 11-870  BTW.  

Al. 11-87?  semi auto right? of 870 pump?


"Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote." -- Benjamin Franklin

"The trouble with Socialism is, sooner or later you run out of other people's money." - Margaret Thatcher

"When you subsidize poverty and failure, you get more of both.." - James Dale Davidson, National Taxpayers Union

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21 minutes ago, Al Bundy said:

Whups Yes 11-87 semi auto compact even. NOT 870 pump.   

I guess form as pygmy said. It won't get much softer shooting that that one.  Good luck. 


"Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote." -- Benjamin Franklin

"The trouble with Socialism is, sooner or later you run out of other people's money." - Margaret Thatcher

"When you subsidize poverty and failure, you get more of both.." - James Dale Davidson, National Taxpayers Union

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X2 on the semi-auto in 20 gauge for recoil sensitivity. Can also try a limb saver slip on pad to cushion the stock, but it will increase the length of stock about 3/4", which may affect fit.

Sent from my SM-G970U using Tapatalk

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