Running shots

[Grouse]

A good article on taking running shots.

We live in a different world today. The mere mention of shooting at running game during a hunter’s ed class would induce chest-gripping seizures among the gray-haired corps of instructors. I get why this is, but those old skills, like many other traditional exercises in woodsmanship, have atrophied and our hunting culture is the poorer for it.

https://www.outdoorlife.com/how-to-shoot-running-game/?utm_medium=social&%3Futm_source=facebook&fbclid=IwAR31XFoJu86AQMbPhitZGe-8sxLXUo7F7w_zgvcYA-wJhXxzGigs-wFXzlI

Edited August 13, 2021 by Grouse

[Einsamer Krieger]

Yes, I totally agree with you, the old skills are gone along with so much more.  Now don't me wrong, I'm damn good at running shots but with that being said, a shot at a deer standing is still  the best.  you as a hunter, well, extra conditions come in when shooting at running game, like where is the bullet going and  where will it end up and etc.

[Enigma]

Ahhhh the good old days. Spray and pray lol. So far beyond the skill of the average Joe hunter but hey, you know, can't kill em' if you ain't throwin' lead! F'n joke . . . 

[airedale]

I have down through the years acquired an extensive collection of hunting and shooting books going back to Teddy Roosevelt's writings on hunting. At one time there was plenty advice and direction on how to take shots on running game and how to place shots at all kinds of angles including rear end shots. It was always advised those shots were to be taken when a hunter's marksmanship, nerves and confidence was up to the task which was accomplished by plenty of practice with whatever weapon one chose to use. There was never anything I read of of sending out a hail of lead and hoping for the best. 

There is a reason Howard Hill and Byron Ferguson shot and shoot a Bow so well, "practice", why Tom Knapp could do all that fancy shooting with those Benelli shotguns, "practice, why Jerry Miculek and Ed Mcgivern were and are such fancy shooters with handguns, "practice" and so on and so on. You will never be a good shot unless you practice and you have to be a darn good shot to hit moving game.

Al

 

 

Edited August 13, 2021 by airedale

[Grouse]

8 hours ago, Enigma said:

Spray and pray lol. So far beyond the skill of the average Joe hunter but hey, you know, can't kill em' if you ain't throwin' lead! F'n joke . . . 

Wow, talk about friendly fire.  You do the anti hunting crowd a huge favor with comments like that.  

Nowhere does that article mention anything like that type of stupidity.  Did you even read it or are you just exposing your opinion about hunters in general?

[Jeremy K]

Isn't it easier just to become a better hunter and not have to shoot a running deer? 

[Grouse]

Let's say you're in your stand and you hear a shot 300 yards away.  Then a huge 10 point buck is coming in your direction at a run.  You know you can make the shot, the deer is only 50 yards away and the backstop is a hill behind it.  The first hunter missed his standing shot at the deer.  Now you have a chance to take it and you do it with one shot.

Who's the better hunter?

Edited August 14, 2021 by Grouse

[jperch]

I guess I started deer hunting in NY in 1970.  On opening day it sounded like a war.  I think the deer got spooked and just kept on running until they found a place to hide.  There were a LOT more hunters then.  My point is people took a lot of shots at running deer and probably killed more trees than deer.  It was all shotguns with foster slugs back then.  I hunted small game quite a bit when I was younger but I do not consider myself even a fair shot at running deer.  Maybe with the cost and scarcity of today's ammunition  people are more hesitant to poke and hope.  Follow up shots are a different matter of course.

[Grouse]

I guess it comes down to a hunter knowing his limitations.

[jperch]

6 minutes ago, Grouse said:

I guess it comes down to a hunter knowing his limitations.

That's what Clint said!

[Grouse]

He said hunters?  

[Jeremy K]

If you you harvest deer by shooting them while they are running full speed then go nuts .  No need to divide hunters even further . 

[Enigma]

57 minutes ago, Grouse said:

Wow, talk about friendly fire.  You do the anti hunting crowd a huge favor with comments like that.  

Nowhere does that article mention anything like that type of stupidity.  Did you even read it or are you just exposing your opinion about hunters in general?

I read it. And no, my comment doesn't give anything to the anti's. But that article might. Nostalgia notwithstanding, today's not much different than the good ol' days. People sucked at marksmanship then and they're worse now. Anyone can write an article for entertainment. You're living in a different time and reality. 

Crap like that article, and the advertising BS today kills us. If you listen to what they tell ya all ya really need is a crossbow and you can shoot them darn deer at 80yds, reach out with your super duper 6.5cr to 400yds and poke one, or crack a spring tom at 60 cause you know, that awesome $6 shell will knock em right over. No practice necessary lol. Not to mention let's roost shoot that tom or take em on the wing cause some douche here posted as an expert. Pathetic.

99% of hunters today couldn't hit a bull in the ass with a shovel, let alone make a killing shot with a firearm on a running deer or any other game animal. To suggest otherwise is a joke.

As stated previously by another poster its all about PRACTICE. But the average Joe hunter today doesn't feel the need and it ends up being spray and pray. And alot of deer shot in the ass to run off and die and tom's being body shot ending up as coyote food.

Whatever. To each their own. 

[Jeremy K]

For one to become proficient at shooting running deer makes me think someone has to have a lot of practice shooting running deer which just seems weird to see that many running deer in their life.

[Enigma]

1 hour ago, Grouse said:

I guess it comes down to a hunter knowing his limitations.

Most "hunters" today know no limitations cause some expert on a podcast told them they could be awesome just like him. Or that youtuber made a once in a lifetime lucky shot and darn it, if he can do it so can I! Where's my 300win mag when I need it?

Limitation of personal ability plays a very small part in the mind of most hunters today. Ethical respect for game is far outweighed by the quest for fame and likes. Sad really. 

Edited August 14, 2021 by Enigma

[Grouse]

Enigma, I'm starting to think you work for PETA with all of those disparaging remarks about "most" hunters.  99% of hunters can't shoot well?  You even put the word "hunters" in quotes.  Once again, friendly fire.

I don't know where you hunt or who you hunt with, but I think you need to upgrade your hunting relationships.  The people I hunt with are all excellent shots and very successful deer, bear and coyote hunters.  The trophies on their wall attest to it.  Most are very good at turkey hunting too.  But I live in the mountains where these folks grew up shooting rifles at game.  I've been at it myself for 50 years now.  I can tell you this, most hunters around here can shoot well and few of them spend much time watching hunting on a computer.  We actually hunt in the field.

I guess your version is a sad reality where you're from, but it's not reality around here.  Being country has it's advantages.

[Gobbler Chaser]

Running shots. We used to call them Hail Marys. Could be running shots have become a thing of the past with most hunters using 3x9 optics today or maybe we just have more sense. I've taken walking shots. With bow they have to be still for me

[wolc123]

Running shots are something I would prefer not to employ, however I have not always had the luxury of avoiding them completely.  As others have mentioned, the real key to making them is lots of practice. Safety of others is also a big concern (know your target and what is beyond).

The last one I took was on a big, late-season doe, about 5 years ago.  That shot struck about 4 inches forward of the hair that I intended to hit, breaking the doe's neck and dropping her dead on the spot.  What made that shot somewhat difficult, is that I had to time it, for when the doe reached a clear shooting lane.  I was up about 10 feet in a stand, and about 40 yards away on flat ground.  That made the shot extremely safe.

The main reason I took that shot was that I really needed the meat.  I had taken just one deer prior that season (a buck with my crossbow), and I had a wife and two kids at home with big appetites.  I made the shot, but almost lost a foot to frostbite.  I got a good soaker in the cold December ditch water, while crossing it to recover the carcass.

That year, I had practiced thousands of moving target shots pre-season.  That was before the current ammunition crisis,  but even then, I was not one who "wasted" real ammo on practice.  All of that "moving target" practice was with my adult-stocked Daisy red Ryder bb gun.

This season, I will be far less likely to take a running shot at a deer.  I haven't had much time to practice and one kid will be off to college. The other will be working at our town's pizza joint (sadly now under new ownership).  I wont need nearly as much venison and should have much more luxury of "picking and choosing" my shots.

Some of you sit up on your high horses and criticize others for taking "un-ethical" shots.  Good for you.  One day you will get what's coming to you.  Until then, I will keep eating good, and I prefer wild red meat taken the way I choose.

Edited August 14, 2021 by wolc123

[airedale]

5 hours ago, Jeremy K said:

For one to become proficient at shooting running deer makes me think someone has to have a lot of practice shooting running deer which just seems weird to see that many running deer in their life.

It will depend on what kind of hunting methods and techniques one employs, if you are still hunting, snow tracking or using drives it is guaranteed you will be seeing plenty of running Deer. Sitting in a blind or up in a tree stand not so much and from what I see on this board that appears to be the way most Deer hunting is done these days.

Also shooting practice on game that is moving is not restricted to Deer, small game hunting and upland game shooting is invaluable for learning good hunting marksmanship. 

Al

Edited August 14, 2021 by airedale

[Just Lucky]

Get ahead of the deer and pick the lane. I don't think it is that difficult in the woods. Open field I think is more difficult.  A deer makes larger bounds, distance is farther,and the deer is moving faster.

[Pygmy]

It has been years since I shot at an unwounded running deer, but back when I started hunting, nearly everybody drove deer,   treestands were unheard of, and if you didn't shoot at running deer, you didn't get much shooting.... Some guys were damn good at it... 

[wolc123]

My very first deer was taken at a full tilt downhill run, at Allhegheny state park, when I was 17.  My uncle (who just recently passed away) was with me.  He, myself, and my dad had a "party permit" for an antlerless deer.

I remember hearing a distant shot, near the top of a mountain, then seeing two deer come barreling down towards us, running as fast as they could.  My uncle pointed, I raised my granddad's old Ithaca 16 gauge, and fired one shot.

After almost 40 years, the rest of the extended family (who still hunt the park every opening weekend) continue to mention that shot now and then.  One of a pair of "button bucks" folded up like a pheasant, sliding to a stop against a tree.  It was struck neatly thru both front shoulders.

In truth, I was likely aiming at the lead fawn, while my slug struck the following of the pair.  It was a few more years before I shot at another running deer, using that same gun.  

That time, I was out back on our farm, hunting alone on opening day.  Most of the rest of the family was down at the park.  I heard a shot next door, then the unmistakable sound of a fast approaching deer.

There was good tracking  snow on the ground.  The plump 6-point buck ran a tightening semi-circle around the chair I was sitting in.   I unloaded that old model 37, as fast as I could pull the trigger and work the slide. 

He was less than 20 yards away when I fired my last shot. I was wishing for a few more.   I remember some surprise, that he did not just fold up like the last couple, at each trigger pull.

I had killed one other buck between those two, a 7 pointer that was standing directly beneath my tree stand.  Once again, he had dropped at the shot, down thru his back at the base of the neck.  Now I had fired 5 more slugs, at almost point blank range, with nothing to show ?

This one (old ironsides maybe) continued on without breaking stride, into the jungle-like brush next door.  I followed red painted spray, on both sides of his tracks about 50 yards in, to where he piled up.  He was hit by only one of my 5 shots, thru the hams and the femoral artery.  It was quite a few years after that before I tried another running shot.

Some will say "I would rather be lucky that good", but the truth is, luck has nothing to do with it.  There is not a living thing that does not end up just exactly where the Man upstairs wants it to go. That includes us and and the sparrows.  Look that up in the good Book, if you can't take my word for it.  Those who choose to ignore that, do so at their peril, and often empty freezer I suppose.

That said, lots of practice is still a good way to get better at running shots.  Many years of experience, and some bunnies and grouse, have taught me that lesson.

Edited August 15, 2021 by wolc123

[jperch]

From Enigma:

"Limitation of personal ability plays a very small part in the mind of most hunters today. Ethical respect for game is far outweighed by the quest for fame and likes. Sad really." 

On our farm we have in recent years found poorly shot and lost deer including a 12 point trophy, a true 8 point monarch, and several lesser bucks and does and fawns.  Some of these were wounded and suffering (My GF, who hunts, does not appreciate that one bit.) to the point that neighbors could and would have recovered them so I suspect poachers.  We almost never allow guest hunters now unless they are new hunters or family.  Oh, we have posted signs removed and (I think) an errant slug hole in the back of the porch!

Sure, it feels great when you make a skillful shot and harvest a nice deer.  But wounding a deer will leave an ethical hunter with a painful memory which will last much, much longer. 

[Daveboone]

When I started hunting in the seventies, shotguns were more the norm than the exception. We shot small game ALOT. Most everyone would say they were primarily small game hunters, but also hunted deer. Thus, most of us also used the same gun for deer as rabbits, etc. We knew our guns well. 

Come NY southern tier deer season, we did a lot of pushing through hedgerows and corn. Jumped running deer were the norm. And we got very good...but I admit, sometimes alot of lead was thrown. Rifles are now allowed in most of those areas, and were welcomed. Techniques have changed, but the deer take is higher now with rifles. Yep, deer are often shot further away, but also more precisely. Very seldom do you hear the artillery barrages that were common in the old days. 

Myself, I am a better shot now than ever, but I also know when and when not to shoot. Generally, i do not make any shots at deer moving faster than a brisk walk....and then I am picky. I respect the animals much more, and will not shoot if I am not going to make a clean kill. My opinion, is throwing lead is the substitute for poor marksmanship.

[Just Lucky]

17 hours ago, wolc123 said:

My very first deer was taken at a full tilt downhill run, at Allhegheny state park, when I was 17.  My uncle (who just recently passed away) was with me.  He, myself, and my dad had a "party permit" for an antlerless deer.

I remember hearing a distant shot, near the top of a mountain, then seeing two deer come barreling down towards us, running as fast as they could.  My uncle pointed, I raised my granddad's old Ithaca 16 gauge, and fired one shot.

After almost 40 years, the rest of the extended family (who still hunt the park every opening weekend) continue to mention that shot now and then.  One of a pair of "button bucks" folded up like a pheasant, sliding to a stop against a tree.  It was struck neatly thru both front shoulders.

In truth, I was likely aiming at the lead fawn, while my slug struck the following of the pair.  It was a few more years before I shot at another running deer, using that same gun.  

That time, I was out back on our farm, hunting alone on opening day.  Most of the rest of the family was down at the park.  I heard a shot next door, then the unmistakable sound of a fast approaching deer.

There was good tracking  snow on the ground.  The plump 6-point buck ran a tightening semi-circle around the chair I was sitting in.   I unloaded that old model 37, as fast as I could pull the trigger and work the slide. 

He was less than 20 yards away when I fired my last shot. I was wishing for a few more.   I remember some surprise, that he did not just fold up like the last couple, at each trigger pull.

I had killed one other buck between those two, a 7 pointer that was standing directly beneath my tree stand.  Once again, he had dropped at the shot, down thru his back at the base of the neck.  Now I had fired 5 more slugs, at almost point blank range, with nothing to show ?

This one (old ironsides maybe) continued on without breaking stride, into the jungle-like brush next door.  I followed red painted spray, on both sides of his tracks about 50 yards in, to where he piled up.  He was hit by only one of my 5 shots, thru the hams and the femoral artery.  It was quite a few years after that before I tried another running shot.

Some will say "I would rather be lucky that good", but the truth is, luck has nothing to do with it.  There is not a living thing that does not end up just exactly where the Man upstairs wants it to go. That includes us and and the sparrows.  Look that up in the good Book, if you can't take my word for it.  Those who choose to ignore that, do so at their peril, and often empty freezer I suppose.

That said, lots of practice is still a good way to get better at running shots.  Many years of experience, and some bunnies and grouse, have taught me that lesson.

Sometimes accuracy by volume works