Antler Restrictions

[PETERBFLY]

I think the Antler Restriction Program is GREAT and I hope it spreads to the entire Southern Zone of NY soon. I am tired of passing up little buck after little buck only to let some other trigger happy hunter kill it. Why cant the quality of bucks in NY be just as good as it is out west? If you want meat for your freezer, shoot a doe. Let the 1.5 YO bucks walk and then you will start to see some quality results. I love to bow hunt and take as many does as I can. I think NY has Potential for some nice bucks, but you trigger happy, part time gun hunters need to stop killing the little bucks.. Most of you refuse to shoot does also, which makes it even worse. I have seen so many pathetic 2.5 YO bucks that could have been so much better, but will never be because of the POOR management in NY. Lots of people will totally disagree with me, but go hunt with an outfitter in Illinois and see QDM at its finest. They have tons of deer and tons of BIG BUCKS.. If you hunt somewhere that you hardly see deer, then may I suggest hunting somewhere better or correcting whatever mistakes you are making so the deer are not educated to your presence.

[wdswtr]

Well this should be interesting

[erussell]

I sometimes get pimples on my arse that wont go away just like threads about AR.

[sweet old bill]

well this is first year for my area 4O. So god willing we will see how it does after several years.

I do think if you want big bucks you have to then change the system to be like Iowa or other big buck states.

The difference is the amount of doe permits, how many days of gun hunting, reduction in gun hunting days and increase in bow hunting days,

Only a one week for black powder and one week of rifle.... in the big buck states.

So if no changes to the current NY tags and the amount of days for guns hunting and how many bucks you can take and current doe tags I think you will not see much of a change at all.

But I keep on hoping that we will some day go back to hunt with whatever you like to use ( bow, rifle, BP, crossbow ) but take onlt one buck per year that has a least 3 on one side.

[gfdeputy2]

Thought this was a good article on AR's

http://www.wellsvilledaily.com/outdoors/x393521678/Antler-restrictions-don-t-work

[orion]

"They have tons of deer and tons of BIG BUCKS."

Maybe that's why it works there. Shooting all the doe here especially in ares with low populations is the worst thing for QDM.

You need a large overpopulation of deer then you add some form of antler restriction and doe management.

This "shoot a doe if you want meat" is whats killing the QDM in NY. There are large portions of the state that don"t have the deer population to support QDM.

Being able to shoot 3 doe in almost any part of the state without any control over where is ridiculous.

Think about it. If you want lets say 1-4.5 mature buck.

You will most likely need 2- 3.5, 3-2.5, 6- 1.5 year old bucks. At a almost unattainable 2:1 doe buck ratio you will need 36 deer per square mile. That's of course if your satisfied with 1 mature deer per square mile and you think you can get a 2:1 ratio.

[SteveB]

I think the Antler Restriction Program is GREAT and I hope it spreads to the entire Southern Zone of NY soon. I am tired of passing up little buck after little buck only to let some other trigger happy hunter kill it. Why cant the quality of bucks in NY be just as good as it is out west? If you want meat for your freezer, shoot a doe. Let the 1.5 YO bucks walk and then you will start to see some quality results. I love to bow hunt and take as many does as I can. I think NY has Potential for some nice bucks, but you trigger happy, part time gun hunters need to stop killing the little bucks.. Most of you refuse to shoot does also, which makes it even worse. I have seen so many pathetic 2.5 YO bucks that could have been so much better, but will never be because of the POOR management in NY. Lots of people will totally disagree with me, but go hunt with an outfitter in Illinois and see QDM at its finest. They have tons of deer and tons of BIG BUCKS.. If you hunt somewhere that you hardly see deer, then may I suggest hunting somewhere better or correcting whatever mistakes you are making so the deer are not educated to your presence.

I replied to your misrepresentations in detail on the other thread.

Illinois is not an AR state - and AR is not qdm.

Illinois 2.5's cannot therefore be "protected" by AR.

Failure to understand the basics does nothing to validate an opinion that ar is needed as a blanket NY program.

Failure to understand that

[SteveB]

Good post Orion - real facts.

[Meat Hunter]

It is true that does do not need to be harvested every where in NY and in areas with few deer doe harvest needs to be limited. ARs are about buck age structure which is improved dramatically by not shooting yearling bucks. And of course this should be instituted in the entire southern zone where it is supported by the majority of Deer hunters. Common sense if you do not shoot little ones they get older.

Very Good Article on ARs

http://www.eveningtribune.com/topstories/x1249727649/Are-antler-restrictions-the-wave-of-the-future-in-NYS?zc_p=3

[WNYBuckHunter]

It is true that does do not need to be harvested every where in NY and in areas with few deer doe harvest needs to be limited.

It already is limited.

[orion]

"It already is limited. "

Yes and no with a archery and muzzleloader stamp you can shoot 2 doe. I believe you can anywhere in the state so theoretically a lot of doe can be shoot in any area without much control.

That's why ALL anterless tags should be DMU specific.

[WNYBuckHunter]

Its all taken into account when they figure out the DMPs. They base it on past trends/success rates in those areas with the Bow/ML tags.

[Culvercreek hunt club]

I think the Antler Restriction Program is GREAT and I hope it spreads to the entire Southern Zone of NY soon. I am tired of passing up little buck after little buck only to let some other trigger happy hunter kill it. Why cant the quality of bucks in NY be just as good as it is out west? If you want meat for your freezer, shoot a doe. Let the 1.5 YO bucks walk and then you will start to see some quality results. I love to bow hunt and take as many does as I can. I think NY has Potential for some nice bucks, but you trigger happy, part time gun hunters need to stop killing the little bucks.. Most of you refuse to shoot does also, which makes it even worse. I have seen so many pathetic 2.5 YO bucks that could have been so much better, but will never be because of the POOR management in NY. Lots of people will totally disagree with me, but go hunt with an outfitter in Illinois and see QDM at its finest. They have tons of deer and tons of BIG BUCKS.. If you hunt somewhere that you hardly see deer, then may I suggest hunting somewhere better or correcting whatever mistakes you are making so the deer are not educated to your presence.

Peter, Many of your assertions are with out fact and based solely on your opinion are wrong on so many points I don't even know where to start.

[steve863]

I think the Antler Restriction Program is GREAT and I hope it spreads to the entire Southern Zone of NY soon. I am tired of passing up little buck after little buck only to let some other trigger happy hunter kill it. Why cant the quality of bucks in NY be just as good as it is out west? If you want meat for your freezer, shoot a doe. Let the 1.5 YO bucks walk and then you will start to see some quality results. I love to bow hunt and take as many does as I can. I think NY has Potential for some nice bucks, but you trigger happy, part time gun hunters need to stop killing the little bucks.. Most of you refuse to shoot does also, which makes it even worse. I have seen so many pathetic 2.5 YO bucks that could have been so much better, but will never be because of the POOR management in NY. Lots of people will totally disagree with me, but go hunt with an outfitter in Illinois and see QDM at its finest. They have tons of deer and tons of BIG BUCKS.. If you hunt somewhere that you hardly see deer, then may I suggest hunting somewhere better or correcting whatever mistakes you are making so the deer are not educated to your presence.

I tell you, the stench is downright unbearable. If some of you clowns didn't already know, it is NOT all about HORNS for many hunters out there.

[jjb4900]

is it just me, or did anyone else notice that the guy's against AR's just come out and admit they don't care about antler size and the guy's for them try to dig up "data" to try and support their argument instead of just saying that they're just interested in big bucks?

[steve863]

is it just me, or did anyone else notice that the guy's against AR's just come out and admit they don't care about antler size and the guy's for them try to dig up "data" to try and support their argument instead of just saying that they're just interested in big bucks?

Nope, it's not just you. It as clear as day. As I said in another thread, they will sooner be claiming that AR's cure cancer in humans, before they will ever admit to the truth.

[orion]

And some against MANDATORY AR's are selective and hunt mature deer VOLUNTARILY!

It's a choice they want all hunters to have.

[nybuckboy]

I've thought about numerous times and can't quite decide about this AR restriction.I don't think counting points is the answer.

I believe most of us know a buck they plan to shoot within the first moments of spotting him. His rack is large enough that we don't necessarily have to count points.

I would propose a 1 buck or 1 doe per season. That is either you take a buck or doe in bow/muzzle and take either a buck or doe in gun season.

This way hunters will pass up small bucks in hope of larger bigger rack bucks. If it comes down to the last few days of the season, they can take a doe. There still can be nuisance permits for land owners issued but I wouldn't want to see any more DMP except perhaps in areas with designated as overpopulated.

There ya go... my thoughts on this AR talk.

PS: Oh and I am the first to admit and have no shame in admitting. "I hunt for Big Racks". I am a trophy first hunter.

Edited September 27, 2012 by nybuckboy

[BizCT]

Antlers (no matter what size) look cool on the wall. Does don't!

I only take the backstraps and donate the rest, its free!

Edited September 27, 2012 by Biz-R-OWorld

[WNYBuckHunter]

I've thought about numerous times and can't quite decide about this AR restriction.I don't think counting points is the answer.

I believe most of us know a buck they plan to shoot within the first moments of spotting him. His rack is large enough that we don't necessarily have to count points.

I would propose a 1 buck or 1 doe per season. That is either you take a buck or doe in bow/muzzle and take either a buck or doe in gun season.

This way hunters will pass up small bucks in hope of larger bigger rack bucks. If it comes down to the last few days of the season, they can take a doe. There still can be nuisance permits for land owners issued but I wouldn't want to see any more DMP except perhaps in areas with designated as overpopulated.

There ya go... my thoughts on this AR talk.

PS: Oh and I am the first to admit and have no shame in admitting. "I hunt for Big Racks". I am a trophy first hunter.

The problem with only allowing 1 doe per hunter is that you are not being effective in population control, which is the main reason we hunt to begin with.

I agree with 1 buck though, for the same reason you stated, people may be more willing to VOLUNTARILY pass up the little guys in hopes of a bigger, or more mature deer to come along.

[SteveB]

And some against MANDATORY AR's are selective and hunt mature deer VOLUNTARILY!

It's a choice they want all hunters to have.

Bingo! You win.

[Geno C]

LOL we should make AR threads illegal...

[steve863]

LOL we should make AR threads illegal...

Better yet, make AR's illegal and I promise you that the AR opponents would never bring up the subject again. Go back and see who starts most of these AR threads and you will see it is not the opponents who start this crap. They AR guys have now gotten their way in the Catskills yet they still can't give it a rest. They just love to rub it in the rest of our faces it seems? Yep, lots of class they have.

[Geno C]

AR's are so beat to death already... its the same thing in each AR Thread, quite comical actually. carry on lol

[oneidacountyhunter]

Do you even know what you're talking about?? So because I don't pass on smaller bucks that makes me a trigger happy part time hunter?? Maybe you should hunt what you want to hunt and let everyone else hunt what they want.