Hochul Strikes Again

[fasteddie]

Hochul Strikes Again Our friends at GOA-NY sent us a copy of an email from 2A Attorney Paloma Capanna which should be of interest to all New York gun owners. The New York State Police held a call to discuss the changes that will impact retailers across the state as New York transitions to being a ‘point of contact state’; that is, the state police will be the initial contact/ clearing house for all background checks for firearms and ammunition. The FBI will stop all connections with Federal Firearms Licensees in New York State once the NYS Police becomes the Point of Contact. All NYS Firearms and Ammunition Dealers can start to register under the new system beginning on August 16th, even though they are already registered as a Federal Firearms Licensee.  Each user (administrators and store employees) will need an NY.gov business account. The targeted date for the NYS Police to take over processing NICS applications is Wednesday, September 13th.  The new background check fee for firearms will be $9 and for ammunition will be $2.50; they will begin on that date.   The state police will be the intermediary for all firearms transactions as background checks will go to NYSP and NYSP will, then, contact NICS.  NICS checks are free so, to use a Mafia phrase, NY State gets to ‘wet its beak’ into an otherwise free transaction. The anti-2A New York bureaucracy is inserting itself into a proven process. There was no concrete information given concerning how the new system will function, recourse for when it fails, an appeals process or the inevitable delays retailers will experience. What could possibly go wrong? Well, for instance… The state police said that there could be situations where someone could pass a background check for a firearm but fail for the ammunition. (Their explanation was that for ammunition they might check more records in state.)  Welcome to New York’s bureaucratic world. Live operators will only be available to help with technical assistance, they will not have the ability to enter NICS applications on behalf of the business.  So much for customer service! For those of us who live close to the Pennsylvania border, it would probably not be financially worthwhile to make a special trip in order to buy ammo, gas price being what it is.  Unless for spite.  But if we happen to be in Pennsylvania…it’s just another jolt to New York’s staggering economy. Did anyone in Hochul’s ‘brain trust’ figure out that if one fails the ammo test, it becomes a short road trip to PA in order to get around this restriction?  Remember what happened when there were ‘dry counties’ in New York?  (At least drivers buying ammo will be sober.) An important reminder: NY’s Income tax form IT-201 line 59 (Sales and Use Tax).  If you buy an item in another state that would be taxable in New York and bring it across state lines, you need to pay NY Sales and Use tax on it.  (SCOPE is just being a good citizen in reminding you of this even though we are sure no SCOPE members would ever dream of shorting NY State on this!)

[airedale]

Par for the course, it is plain to see they are going after ammo in any way they can, have control of ammo you control guns.

The fools just keep voting for democrats!

Al

[fasteddie]

Can you imaging buying a small box of 22's for say $4 and having to pay $2.50 to be checked out . Buy what you can before September 13 or drive to Pennsylvania ...........

[boo711]

1 hour ago, fasteddie said:

Can you imaging buying a small box of 22's for say $4 and having to pay $2.50 to be checked out . Buy what you can before September 13 or drive to Pennsylvania ...........

I can only see the left side of what you posted Loki g on my phone??  Will try laptop later. Heading to NC next weekend to move my daughter there. Thought about buying ammo but am flying home.  Can you put ammo in checked luggage??  Anyone know??  

[DirtTime]

I plan to make special trips to buy most ammo, and have already made a few. I'll especially be doing that for all my AR ammo.

 

Until.......

You wait and see, with NYSP in charge of the checks you can bet the qualifications are going to be altered for all firearms. You have to remember, that guy in charge of the NYSP is the guy who helped Cuomo sneak the Safe Act in and is also responsible for helping push the ammo background check and semi auto rifle permits though. So don't be fooled for a minute into thinking anything will get easier for us. I give it a couple years and we are going to have to have training and permits for all firearms, most likely including muzzle loaders.

 

I can't express how much I despise the people who voted her into office and the people who voted jackass Joe in as well. 

[Doc]

Does any of this nonsense impact the buying of ammo components and supplies?

[fasteddie]

4 hours ago, Doc said:

Does any of this nonsense impact the buying of ammo components and supplies?

I hope not . Get what you can while you can .............

[airedale]

15 hours ago, Doc said:

Does any of this nonsense impact the buying of ammo components and supplies?

Not so far but I believe reloading supplies will be in their sights before too long, I buy what I can now, it stores and keeps well long term.

Al

[Grouse]

Will non-residents be able to buy ammo in NY now? 

Some states are really putting big time restrictions on out of state ammo sales.  I was in NJ and was going to buy a box of .22 LR until they asked to see my NY pistol permit.  I told them it was for a bolt action rifle.  They said it's pistol ammo and I could not buy it unless I had a NY pistol permit.  At that point I just decided I did not wish to comply, preferring to stay off that tyrannical state's radar.

[Grouse]

[airedale]

Can't blame Mudd Creek for bailing, the hassle for the sport shops is becoming overbearing and that is the Democrat's plan, the noose is getting tighter. The part these Democrat morons can not get into their heads is it really only hurts the legal sportsmen. 

It will have a zero effect for the dirtbag criminals shooting up the cities, they will get their ammo and keep on blasting away.

Al

Edited August 29, 2023 by airedale

[Grouse]

The Democrats hate all guns.  They know it hurts legal sportsmen.  They want them disarmed too.  The utopia they seek is an unrealistic ideal that can never be achieved, but they intend to destroy us all trying to achieve it.

[Bigfoot 327]

This is not really about ammo. If you purchase 30-06 rounds they will add a 30-06 next to your name in their gun registry. They are doing everything they can to learn who has what for the day they come door to door (their ultimate goal)'

[Grouse]

None of this will stop "straw purchases" of ammo by people able to pass a background check who want to sell it to criminals for a profit.  Ammo has no serial number and cannot be distinguished from any other ammo of the same make and caliber.

So criminals will still get the ammo they want by using straw purchasers that will make money doing it.

This law will probably create a huge black market for ammo purchased in other states and sold face to face in NY.  Ammo sellers in NY are the ones that will suffer the huge loss of revenue.  NY will also suffer the loss of tax revenue from ammo sales.

Another example of how dumb Democrats are.

[suburbanfarmer]

Was at a dealer who said, they cant suffice with the fees structure. If they need to remain in business they will charge $15-30 for the background checks of ammo sales just like a firearm transfer

[DirtTime]

6 hours ago, suburbanfarmer said:

Was at a dealer who said, they cant suffice with the fees structure. If they need to remain in business they will charge $15-30 for the background checks of ammo sales just like a firearm transfer

Yeah, they can all suck a fat one too! I'm not paying anyone $15 or more for something that cost $2.50. All they have to do is type a few things on a computer taking less then two minutes. Wait until for some stupid reason someone fails the check and are told they have to pay a 25-30% restocking fee like with firearms. 

[New York Hillbilly]

On 8/19/2023 at 1:58 PM, DirtTime said:

I can't express how much I despise the people who voted her into office and the people who voted jackass Joe in as well. 

While I don't despise the people themselves personally, I do despise their actions that have resulted in this entirely predictable situation we face. A quick show of hands. How many on this site (or previously here) voted this country into this mess?

Anybody have integrity  enough to admit it? At the rate were going we may end up having to hunt with boomerangs! 

[Grouse]

You may not despise them, but they have made it clear they despise you.  When they actively support the threat of force and violence against all who oppose them, they hate you.  That's the truth about totalitarian fascists.  They want to impose their will on everyone and will use any means available to do it.  Our side better begin to understand the anti's are never going to back down and start voting as if our lives depend on it, because they do.

[steve863]

10 hours ago, DirtTime said:

Yeah, they can all suck a fat one too! I'm not paying anyone $15 or more for something that cost $2.50. All they have to do is type a few things on a computer taking less then two minutes. Wait until for some stupid reason someone fails the check and are told they have to pay a 25-30% restocking fee like with firearms. 

 

Agreed.  These dealers are then just as bad as the politicians who passed this law.  I get that this law seriously hurts their business and wastes a lot of their time.  I feel for them, but if they are tacking on fees that are several times those mandated by the state then they are screwing gun owners just like the politicians are.  This is one reason I prefer buying hunting items from big box type stores like Cabelas, Bass Pro, etc.  In my experience it has never felt like the big box stores try to screw me as much as the small dealers do.

 

 

 

 

[Grouse]

The dealers are not the enemy in this situation.

[DirtTime]

4 hours ago, Grouse said:

The dealers are not the enemy in this situation.

Anyone trying to jack up prices and gouge is the enemy on anything! You crack me up man! If I try to sell you something that cost $2.50 for $30 who's fault is it that I put that price on the item? C'mon man! Maybe not the enemy directly, but if they were our friends they would charge what they are supposed to charge and not take advantage of this situation to make a huge profit by jacking the price up over 1000%.

Edited September 1, 2023 by DirtTime
grammer

[Grouse]

Nobody is doing that and if they were you can just go to somebody that isn't.  They are reacting to this government oppression just like everyone else and I for one will not blame them for trying not to lose money.  That $2.50 the government says they can charge does NOT cover their time and labor when you remember they have to fill out and submit a ton of info to the state regarding each purchase and be ready to defend all of it if they are ever asked to. You are free to choose to deal with them or not.  They are not the people my anger will be directed at.  The state would like them to be though, and people who don't understand the issue will fall for it.

[DirtTime]

On 9/1/2023 at 3:42 PM, Grouse said:

Nobody is doing that and if they were you can just go to somebody that isn't.  They are reacting to this government oppression just like everyone else and I for one will not blame them for trying not to lose money.  That $2.50 the government says they can charge does NOT cover their time and labor when you remember they have to fill out and submit a ton of info to the state regarding each purchase and be ready to defend all of it if they are ever asked to. You are free to choose to deal with them or not.  They are not the people my anger will be directed at.  The state would like them to be though, and people who don't understand the issue will fall for it.

Once again you prove you won't stand behind your convictions. You spout off all the time on we need to take a stand against them chipping away at our 2A right, but you're OK paying extreme fees jacked up by store owners to take advantage of these laws. I swear, you don't read what you type at all.  Practice that crap you preach or stay off the soap box man! I won't be buying my ammo in NY any more because I will not bow to the tyranny and I certainly won't be paying an inflated fee to someone who's already getting paid to do their job.

[Grouse]

Who's forcing you to?  Where did I say I'm OK with this?  Try improving your reading comprehension. I'm not OK with paying extra fees and I will not do business with anyone who tries to charge them, but I won't say they can't or blame them for something that the government has incented them to do.

Knock off the personal attacks and stick to the issue.

And if you think you can tell me what to do, you've got another think coming.

Edited September 3, 2023 by Grouse

[SportsmanNH]

On 9/1/2023 at 3:42 PM, Grouse said:

 They are reacting to this government oppression just like everyone else and I for one will not blame them for trying not to lose money.  That $2.50 the government says they can charge does NOT cover their time and labor when you remember they have to fill out and submit a ton of info to the state regarding each purchase and be ready to defend all of it if they are ever asked to. 

 

15 hours ago, DirtTime said:

  but you're OK paying extreme fees jacked up by store owners to take advantage of these laws. I won't be buying my ammo in NY any more because I will not bow to the tyranny and I certainly won't be paying an inflated fee to someone who's already getting paid to do their job.

First of all , I want to say I like both you guys , so this is not an attack on either of you . But I have to say you are both wrong on these posts .As you know I am an outsider from New Hampshire looking in . We dont have these bullchit laws up here .  So this is how I see these new laws and fees and how you are both wrong .

Grouse :  You said the $2.50 fee that the gun shops are "allowed " to charge wont cover their expenses . Sorry , but the real law says that the $2.50 fee for ammo and  $9 fee for gun purchase backround checks is NOT being charged by the gun shop . It is being charged by the State !  The gun shop gets ZERO for the extra work of the sale and record keeping of ammo purchases. There should not be ANY extra fees charged by the shop for gun purchases since they are required to keep those records by law anyway regardless if its for the State Police or the ATF . This article spells out the State fees

 https://www.wgrz.com/article/news/local/new-york/gun-dealers-wait-nys-new-gun-ammo-background-check-policies/71-737136fa-4fd5-4faa-85f1-68d1f680b8f9

DirtTime : After reading what I wrote to Grouse , I ask you to , since the gun shop is NOT being compensated for the backround checks , do you think that they deserve some kind of compensation for their work ?  Just think as a business owner for a second about this scenario . Before you could walk in put a box of ammo on the counter and pay for it and leave . Now you will walk in , put your ammo on the counter , you have to fill out a form , the clerk has to enter your info or call it in. You have no idea if its going to be delayed or instant response by the system . So if you are delayed ( which I expect a ton of them will ) what happens to the ammo ? The clerk has to take it and put it aside somewhere for possibly 3 days. Just like a delay with a gun purchase. So now what. You have a room full of ammo boxes with slips on them keeping track of who it is for when they get the green light for the sale. On top of that , they have to keep perfect records of who is buying what and when they bought it. Dont forget , these are not higher margin gun sales. It would take at least 20 to 30 boxes of ammo sales to make the same amount of money as selling ONE new mid priced to above average priced firearm. I was told the profit margin on those is 20 to 30 percent and ammo is 10 to 15 percent . So instead of the paperwork for one sale , now they have to deal with 20 times the paperwork for the same money, and possibly handle that box of ammo TWICE if there is a delay . So what does it realistically cost that shop to do all these ammo sales . Lets say on a busy day they sell 50 boxes of ammo to 50 different guys . If it only takes 5 minutes extra to file all this bullchit for each sale , it would take someone 4 to 5 hours to enter all the info on a comp plus file the paperwork in a cabinet . That clerk could of been doing something more useful , like stocking shelves or talking with customers wanting to buy a new gun.  Last I remember you have to keep the paper copies for everything that involves a backround check forever. A busy store is going to need additions to store all those new file cabinets for all this bullchit paperwork . 

 I have bought a few guns on Gunbroker and had it shipped to FFL dealers here in NH . The fees they charged to do the transfers has been 20-30 dollars per gun . But if any shop tells me they are going to charge a fee of 30 dollars for a box of ammo , I would walk out and never to return . To cover the cost to do this paperwork for the shop is about 2 dollars based on the 5 hours of clerk filing time . I can see a shop charging either 2 bucks a box or 5 bucks a transaction if you are buying at least 3 boxes at a time. If you bought 5 boxes or more they might not charge a fee at all .  Who knows . It is still all chaos right now.

Edited September 4, 2023 by SportsmanNH