Escape from New York

[Steuben Jerry]

So, after almost 60 years of being a NYS resident, we’re strongly considering leaving New York State for retirement in a few short years. We currently have a 10 year old home on 86 acres, and I can barely remember when I hunted somewhere else. I love it, but I simply don’t want to be financially burdened in retirement with what the property taxes have become here. And to a lesser extent, other high costs, restrictive laws/regs, and stupid liberal politics are contributing factors.

We built the current place in 2009, and after all the final assessment dust had settled, our combined annual property taxes were around $4700. Fast forward 10 years to today and my taxes have ballooned into $13,000. And we have done nothing to improve the house itself in that time. It’s only an 1800 sq ft ranch/chalet style house on an unfinished walkout basement. 30 x 40 pole barn for a garage. At this rate of increase, I figure I’ll be paying $16K/year or more when I’m 65. And that will just keep increasing at 70, 75, 80.

So, we’re taking our first exploratory vacation mission in August. We are going to check out the Clarksville, VA area which is near the VA/NC state lines. Geographically speaking, it’s exactly what I think we want. A large lake system, and close by rural areas. It’s in the Mid-Atlantic States, and a couple hour drive to the ocean. A small ranch on 50 acres there is typically taxed around $1200-ish per year, or about what I set aside for one month of taxes here. That’s a lot of money per month that we could help us enjoy retirement quite a bit more! And if there’s enough savings, it could make the difference between retiring at 62 or 65 or older. Or in how nice of a retirement boat I buy.

I’m trying to gather other “mission” destinations to check out that offer rural living, close-by water for boating and fishing, and opportunities to hunt whether it’s on my own land or leasing nearby land. Oh yeah, and less stupid laws and regs, with a much lower cost of living. Avoiding winter isn’t a big issue, but lesser winters than we get here are appealing as long as there’s some changing seasons. Somewhere around the eastern U.S. is desirable to keep us at a reasonable drive for family.

So I thought I’d ask the most like-minded group of people that I know for “mission” suggestions.

Tennessee, North Carolina, West Virginia? Let’s hear it from the folks who know. Where would you look if you were in our shoes?

It’s a damn shame what NY has become. Although it’s an old marketing slogan, I really do love New York. Big Cities, Great Lakes, Finger Lakes, Mountains, etc. No other state comes close to the ecological and geographical diversity we have here.

[ny hunter]

I am about ten years from retirement myself,and i am heading either NC or SC...hate to say it but we are so done with NY......So you are not alone ............

[Jeremy K]

The state just can't get their hands deep enough in everyone's pockets to fund their inability to properly do their job. 

[Robhuntandfish]

Surely can't blame you when financially those taxes are just monstrous. Must also be the area your in NY.  Taxes this way are cert a lot less.   

But it's hard to pass out on missing out winters too.  Life is harder having to fight winter every year. 

I have a good buddy that lives in VA, he loves it.  But there are some areas there too with high taxes as it's also a place a lot of DC people look to live. Where he is in VA there is little to no lakes to fish and the one lake gets pounded.  But they have a nice pond in their development.

I have thought about moving to Tennessee or Kentucky area myself, but it's never an easy decision.  

I can't imagine paying those kind of taxes.  

Edited May 31, 2018 by Robhuntandfish

[Lawdwaz]

1 hour ago, Steuben Jerry said:

So, after almost 60 years of being a NYS resident, we’re strongly considering leaving New York State for retirement in a few short years. We currently have a 10 year old home on 86 acres, and I can barely remember when I hunted somewhere else. I love it, but I simply don’t want to be financially burdened in retirement with what the property taxes have become here. And to a lesser extent, other high costs, restrictive laws/regs, and stupid liberal politics are contributing factors.

We built the current place in 2009, and after all the final assessment dust had settled, our combined annual property taxes were around $4700. Fast forward 10 years to today and my taxes have ballooned into $13,000. And we have done nothing to improve the house itself in that time. It’s only an 1800 sq ft ranch/chalet style house on an unfinished walkout basement. 30 x 40 pole barn for a garage. At this rate of increase, I figure I’ll be paying $16K/year or more when I’m 65. And that will just keep increasing at 70, 75, 80.

So, we’re taking our first exploratory vacation mission in August. We are going to check out the Clarksville, VA area which is near the VA/NC state lines. Geographically speaking, it’s exactly what I think we want. A large lake system, and close by rural areas. It’s in the Mid-Atlantic States, and a couple hour drive to the ocean. A small ranch on 50 acres there is typically taxed around $1200-ish per year, or about what I set aside for one month of taxes here. That’s a lot of money per month that we could help us enjoy retirement quite a bit more! And if there’s enough savings, it could make the difference between retiring at 62 or 65 or older. Or in how nice of a retirement boat I buy.

I’m trying to gather other “mission” destinations to check out that offer rural living, close-by water for boating and fishing, and opportunities to hunt whether it’s on my own land or leasing nearby land. Oh yeah, and less stupid laws and regs, with a much lower cost of living. Avoiding winter isn’t a big issue, but lesser winters than we get here are appealing as long as there’s some changing seasons. Somewhere around the eastern U.S. is desirable to keep us at a reasonable drive for family.

So I thought I’d ask the most like-minded group of people that I know for “mission” suggestions.

Tennessee, North Carolina, West Virginia? Let’s hear it from the folks who know. Where would you look if you were in our shoes?

It’s a damn shame what NY has become. Although it’s an old marketing slogan, I really do love New York. Big Cities, Great Lakes, Finger Lakes, Mountains, etc. No other state comes close to the ecological and geographical diversity we have here.

So sad to hear but I surely don't blame you for looking elsewhere........

Your place sounds like my dream home but at 13K a year in taxes I couldn't swallow it either.  Well I guess I could but I'd have to get the house, barn and land for free.......THEN I'm in.

[grampy]

Lived outside Charleston SC, in Summerville, for a few years and really liked it! Great hunting and fishing! Beautiful beaches and rivers. But I fell in love with the BlueRidge and Smoky Mts of NC and Tennessee. Would make the drive up there every chance I got. 

If I were to move when retirement comes, it would be to the Ashville NC area. Taxes are very reasonable. Cost of living much lower than here. No stupid worthless gun laws. Still have all four seasons, though winter isn't five months long like here. Mountains, just a short drive away. Hunting and fishing opportunities abound! And are spectacular in quality and quantity. 

I too, love NY. But I don't think I can afford to retire here. I wish you the best of luck and much happiness, in your search, and retirement.

 

[Steve D]

1 hour ago, Steuben Jerry said:

So, after almost 60 years of being a NYS resident, we’re strongly considering leaving New York State

I along with many others feel your pain. My taxes have gone up over 100% since we built the house and we just got hit with another $20,000 assessment increase saying that doesn't mean taxes will be increasing    ha ha .

Being from NY I can't imagine anywhere else I would be willing to relocate to and call home. Home is where the heart is and regardless of where you live that will never change.

[bugsNbows]

I’m also considering a relocation... out of Florida (left NYS) many moons ago. My research has led me to north GA in the mountains. GA has very good, retirement friendly laws, the country is beautiful and the climate nice. It is like an upgraded NYS. PM me for specific info if interested.

[Buckmaster7600]

If things stay the same I’ll be doing the same thing in 21yrs and 2 months when I can retire. It’s sad how terrible this state treats its residents. I figure by then my homestead will be worth at least a million$’s. I’ll take my NY state retirement and spend my money elsewhere. I’ll keep my camp and sell the house and property.


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[chas0218]

I think we talked before and in your location it is similar to other areas in Steuben. I'm in Chemung and have a similar setup (new garage/barn next year). I figure we will be right around $8k in taxes in Chemung County with a 3000 sq.ft. house. You could move to another area where taxes aren't as bad. I don't blame you for wanting to leave.

Edited May 31, 2018 by chas0218

[Robhuntandfish]

have found that leasing to hunt is so much cheaper than buying. Restricted cause you cant just do whatever you want with land.  But even if you pay $2000 a year your still way ahead.  Just have to find the right setup.  I bought a cottage, just off the lake enough to avoid waterfront taxes and then lease 120 acres for hunting. Sure couldnt afford waterfront taxes or taxes on that much land so went to plan B. Mortage and taxes and ins together are less than $600 a month , cant rent something for that. Yet i can see the lake from my backyard and be on the water in 5 minutes or be on hunting lease in 5 minutes.  The landowner from lease also gets tax break as he had foundation for wetlands come in and do a bunch of work on his land (with some requirements) and we also pay to hunt it, so it helps him out too. 

 

[Steuben Jerry]

32 minutes ago, chas0218 said:

I think we talked before and in your location it is similar to other areas in Steuben. I'm in Chemung and have a similar setup (new garage/barn next year). I figure we will be right around $8k in taxes in Chemung County with a 3000 sq.ft. house. You could move to another area where taxes aren't as bad. I don't blame you for wanting to leave.

I remember. I don't necessarily think it's too out of line for NY in general, it's just out of line for the country! My house is on 7 acres separate from the other 79. The house and lot itself is around $9800. The balance is on the rest of the land.

It's expected in a rural area where the population density is thin. My town has 50 some miles of roads to maintain, and the population is only around 1300 people. And a majority of the town and county tax money goes straight to Albany for unfunded mandates. I'm happy to pay a little more to live in a rural area than a suburban setting. A friend of mine in Webster, NY pays high $6K annual for an older raised ranch on less than an acre where you can hear your neighbors quiet conversations and smell what they're cooking for dinner. Plinking a Ruger 10/22 in the backyard gets the SWAT team to rain down on you!

[Nomad]

Nicely put and well thought out . If we were to move it would most likely be Tenn. low property taxes , no state income tax, although you may pay more in some fees here and there, but nothing to bad. 

Sleeper state for deer hunting, great fishing , tons of lakes, milder winters .

My one nephew moved there 20 plus years ago.

We don’t pay to,much in property taxes ( relatively ) on our small home here, just under 5K, but it would drop to $800-$1000 on homes we’ve looked at online in Tenn. some of those with lake views and access .

I would love to buy on the water here and have two,freinds on the Bay, but there is no way I’d ever pay $20k in taxes to,do,so . Unless we had five million in liquid assets and I’d still be pissed .

hum I’m in Webster pay under 5K don’t tell anyone...... 

Edited May 31, 2018 by Stay at home Nomad

[Steuben Jerry]

11 hours ago, grampy said:

If I were to move when retirement comes, it would be to the Ashville NC area.

I visited the area when I was young and liked it, so I have done some researching. Housing prices seemed to be a bit higher there, especially on some acerage - I'll have to give that another look-see.

Thanks!

[chas0218]

7 minutes ago, Steuben Jerry said:

I remember. I don't necessarily think it's too out of line for NY in general, it's just out of line for the country! My house is on 7 acres separate from the other 79. The house and lot itself is around $9800. The balance is on the rest of the land.

It's expected in a rural area where the population density is thin. My town has 50 some miles of roads to maintain, and the population is only around 1300 people. And a majority of the town and county tax money goes straight to Albany for unfunded mandates. I'm happy to pay a little more to live in a rural area than a suburban setting. A friend of mine in Webster, NY pays high $6K annual for an older raised ranch on less than an acre where you can hear your neighbors quiet conversations and smell what they're cooking for dinner. Plinking a Ruger 10/22 in the backyard gets the SWAT team to rain down on you!

Yeah our previous house had $4k in taxes it was 1/3 of an acre with houses on all sides. Also had the highway close enough where you could barely carry on a conversation in the backyard. I'm happy to be where I am even with the higher taxes, we plan on leaving once we retire to a more northern area near my parents probably still in NY though.

[Steuben Jerry]

12 minutes ago, Stay at home Nomad said:

If we were to move it would most likely be Tenn.

I'm definitely researching the northeastern part of TN.

Edited May 31, 2018 by Steuben Jerry

[Uncle Nicky]

I'm somewhat in the same boat Jerry.

I bought hunting land 15 years ago in Allegany county, near Arkport. My plan at that time was to retire there, but as I get older, the reality is that I don't want to spend 6 months looking and driving in the snow, and neither does my wife. Plus the property taxes are choking me each spring when I write the check. I have a buyer who is taking over in February 2019.

This corner of PA where I live is becoming WAY too crowded and expensive. And I have the feeling my days at the corporate job are coming to an end sooner than later, I don't like the direction the company is headed in, and I'm pretty sure they'd get rid of me if they could find a way. And I'm not interested in reinventing myself at this age and starting all over at another office job.

I'm looking at a few places, I just have to get the spouse on board. I know she doesn't want to move too far, if it was entirely my choice, I'd head to southern Georgia (I have friends & connections there) or rural Florida. But Mrs. doesn't want to go that far. So, a compromise looks like the answer. I also have 2 twenty-somethings living at home, I'm not sure what they are going to do (neither do they), but some decisions are going to have to be made soon.

A few places that I'm looking at, that would still be within 5-6 hours of my current home:

1). Southern Delaware

2). Eastern Shore of Maryland or Virginia

3). Stretch of Virginia on I-64 between Charlottesville & Richmond

4). NE corner of North Carolina

Edited May 31, 2018 by Uncle Nicky

[chas0218]

12 minutes ago, Stay at home Nomad said:

Nicely put and well thought out . If we were to move it would most likely be Tenn. low property taxes , no state income tax, although you may pay more in some fees here and there, but nothing to bad. 

Sleeper state for deer hunting, great fishing , tons of lakes, milder winters .

My one nephew moved there 20 plus years ago.

We don’t pay to,much in property taxes ( relatively ) on our small home here, just under 5K, but it would drop to $800-$1000 on homes we’ve looked at online in Tenn. some of those with lake views and access .

I would love to buy on the water here and have two,freinds on the Bay, but there is no way I’d ever pay $20k in taxes to,do,so . Unless we had five million in liquid assets and I’d still be pissed .

Holy crap what kind of homes do they have on the bay? I'm up near the St. Lawrence and our property taxes on 50' of waterfront are around $3500 for 2 lots one that is just over an acre right behind our cottage lot.

Edited May 31, 2018 by chas0218

[Steuben Jerry]

15 minutes ago, chas0218 said:

Yeah our previous house had $4k in taxes it was 1/3 of an acre with houses on all sides. Also had the highway close enough where you could barely carry on a conversation in the backyard. I'm happy to be where I am even with the higher taxes, we plan on leaving once we retire to a more northern area near my parents probably still in NY though.

Unfortunately, it pretty much is what it is in this state. There are folks that are paying lower taxes per house value, but those places haven't been re-assessed in a while and will be. Happened to me when I lived near Rochester. I knew we were undervalued, but after a couple of years they did a town wide assessment and my taxes pretty much doubled the next year.

[Steuben Jerry]

16 minutes ago, Uncle Nicky said:

3). Stretch of Virginia on I-64 between Charlottesville & Richmond

4). NE corner of North Carolina

Putting those on the future recon mission list - Thanks!

[Nomad]

Joe’s house is the lower one, and it’s not technically water front ,as the strip along the water is a different owner , that they have right of way on .

20 k is a rough number based on comments he’s made . Looking online it seems 8-10 k for an average sized home on a tiny lot .

My sister pays 20k for her house on a creek in Greeece NY, but it was 3/4 million to buy , her son has a nicer home in Tenn. he pays 2k .

[Steuben Jerry]

26 minutes ago, Stay at home Nomad said:

We don’t pay to,much in property taxes ( relatively ) on our small home here, just under 5K, but it would drop to $800-$1000 on homes we’ve looked at online in Tenn. some of those with lake views and access .

And that's the thing right there. The tax savings over 10 years alone will probably approach $150k. So the choice is "give" it away to taxes, or buy a boat, pay a hunting lease, take a guided hunt or two every year. All while living in a better climate (still want seasons though), and no stupid over-restrictive laws.

[chas0218]

24 minutes ago, Steuben Jerry said:

Unfortunately, it pretty much is what it is in this state. There are folks that are paying lower taxes per house value, but those places haven't been re-assessed in a while and will be. Happened to me when I lived near Rochester. I knew we were undervalued, but after a couple of years they did a town wide assessment and my taxes pretty much doubled the next year.

Yup our cottage was that way it looks like a pile from the outside because of the siding but is completely updated inside. We bought it condemned and completely gutted it to the studs. Replaced everything except the shell and the kitchen cabinets. They came through and reassessed us for double and the exterior didn't change. We are only assessed for $56k for the front lot.

Looks like a pile but at least our taxes are low. They built a shell around the existing trailer and then built an addition on the end for the dining room, living room and kitchen. 

 

19 minutes ago, Stay at home Nomad said:

Joe’s house is the lower one, and it’s not technically water front ,as the strip along the water is a different owner , that they have right of way on .

20 k is a rough number based on comments he’s made . Looking online it seems 8-10 k for an average sized home on a tiny lot .

My sister pays 20k for her house on a creek in Greeece NY, but it was 3/4 million to buy , her son has a nicer home in Tenn. he pays 2k .

Wow that's insane.

Edited May 31, 2018 by chas0218

[bugsNbows]

I have researched several areas in SW VA, NC, SC, TN and GA. I have chosen the mountain area of North GA to concentrate on. GA does have a state income tax but... for folks over 65, they exempt all retirement income up to 65K per individual and 130K per married. They do not tax SS benefits. The sales tax is 4% (if memory serves me well) and property taxes are MUCH less than in NYS. The four seasons are still there, and there is a lot of National Forest and huntable land. The people are friendly and helpful. My wife and I just returned from there house hunting, and will be heading back soon. It's only about an 8 hour drive up from the Orlando area. My next choice was TN then NC. VA gets too cold for my thin Florida blood. In SC, Charleston is great but pricey. It gets too damn hot in interior SC and GA in the summer.

[bugsNbows]

Forgot, here are a couple of pics from the N GA mountains just below Hiawassee. Tell me that isn't pretty!