New riots in Rochester

[9jNYstarkOH]

 

[suburbanfarmer]

Sad state of affairs

Edited February 2, 2021 by suburbanfarmer

[Moho81]

I think you misspelled “peaceful protesters”


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[Grouse]

Time for some less than lethal responses with rubber bullets and 12 gauge beanbags, followed by tear gas.

[Five Seasons]

but wait, didn't they just get nominated for a nobel peace prize? 

[Northcountryman]

Unbelieveable , anyone know what these idiots are ritoing about this time?

[Splitear]

42 minutes ago, Northcountryman said:

Unbelieveable , anyone know what these idiots are ritoing about this time?

I'll say this first off, I do not agree with rioting, but the "idiots" are protesting the police handcuffing and pepper spraying a 9 year old girl. I know the whole video isn't available, and therefore a lot of context is missing, but to say it's hard to watch is an understatement. 

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/police-pepper-spray-9-year-old-girl-rochester-n-y-n1256313

[9jNYstarkOH]

18 minutes ago, Splitear said:

I'll say this first off, I do not agree with rioting, but the "idiots" are protesting the police handcuffing and pepper spraying a 9 year old girl. I know the whole video isn't available, and therefore a lot of context is missing, but to say it's hard to watch is an understatement. 

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/police-pepper-spray-9-year-old-girl-rochester-n-y-n1256313

What do you think the police should do to a kid that apparently the parents can’t handle and is so bad they feel the need to call the police after she threatened them?

[Splitear]

10 minutes ago, 9jNYstarkOH said:

What do you think the police should do to a kid that apparently the parents can’t handle and is so bad they feel the need to call the police after she threatened them?

I don't know, but I'm not comfortable seeing a 9 year old girl, let me repeat that, A 9 YEAR OLD, NINE YEARS OLD, screaming for her dad get pepper sprayed while handcuffed in the back of a squad car, are you? Maybe I'm a bit too sensitive about stuff like that though...

Edited February 2, 2021 by Splitear

[9jNYstarkOH]

6 minutes ago, Splitear said:

I don't know, but I'm not comfortable seeing a 9 year old girl, let me repeat that, A 9 YEAR OLD, NINE YEARs OLD, screaming for her dad get pepper sprayed while handcuffed in the back of a squad car, are you? Maybe I'm a bit too sensitive about stuff like that though...

I am not comfortable with it but I am also not comfortable with allowing the 9 year old to threaten their parents to the point the police are needed. I asked you as you seem to be able to see things from both sides not as a attack.

[Northcountryman]

27 minutes ago, Splitear said:

 

 

2 minutes ago, Splitear said:

I don't know, but I'm not comfortable seeing a 9 year old girl, let me repeat that, A 9 YEAR OLD, NINE YEARs OLD, screaming for her dad get pepper sprayed while handcuffed in the back of a squad car, are you? Maybe I'm a bit too sensitive about stuff like that though...

I understand what you’re saying , but if the kid is that out of control , it may have been necessary in order to establish control over the situation. Are you suggesting that they should have employed other means to gain custody of her ? Are you a cop ? I’m not and have never been in that situation So I would refrain from judging —AND RIOTING—until more facts are made public . Please don’t misunderstand , I’m not attacking you , I’m just saying that people jump to conclusions too damn quick — I sort of did too when I referred to them as “idiots” , not knowing anything about their motives , right ?And , you sorta called me on it , which is completely legitimate .  But at least I didn’t riot cuz I assumed the police used excessive force when it may have been totally justified !! 

[Splitear]

Just now, 9jNYstarkOH said:

I am not comfortable with it but I am also not comfortable with allowing the 9 year old to threaten their parents to the point the police are needed. I asked you as you seem to be able to see things from both sides not as a attack.

Like I said, I know there is more to this than what the video showed. However, I don't know what could justify use of pepper spray against a handcuffed 4th grader. I certainly don't think using pepper spray as a compliance tool with a child is okay, so if the only reason they sprayed her is because she wouldn't listen to them, to me, that's not okay. 

If something comes out that changes my mind about this instance, then I will be the first to say so, but from the information that is currently available, which admittedly is very little, it doesn't look good to me.

[virgil]

5 minutes ago, Northcountryman said:

 

 

I understand what you’re saying , but if the kid is that out of control , it may have been necessary in order to establish control over the situation. Are you suggesting that they should have employed other means to gain custody of her ? Are you a cop ? I’m not and have never been in that situation So I would refrain from judging —AND RIOTING—until more facts are made public . Please don’t misunderstand , I’m not attacking you , I’m just saying that people jump to conclusions too damn quick — I sort of did too when I referred to them as “idiots” , not knowing anything about their motives , right ?And , you sorta called me on it , which is completely legitimate .  But at least I didn’t riot cuz I assumed the police used excessive force when it may have been totally justified !! 

No excuse for riots.  But, the kid was under control- handcuffed and in the back of a squad car.  The police are not supposed to issue punishment- they're supposed to contain an imminent threat.  The kid is obviously a troubled kid.  But, at the time she was pepper sprayed, she was not a threat to anyone.

[Northcountryman]

Just now, virgil said:

No excuse for riots.  But, the kid was under control- handcuffed and in the back of a squad car.  The police are not supposed to issue punishment- they're supposed to contain an imminent threat.  The kid is obviously a troubled kid.  But, at the time she was pepper sprayed, she was not a threat to anyone.

Are you sure ? I don’t know myself ; did you see footage of the events unfolding or something ? 

[Splitear]

17 minutes ago, Northcountryman said:

 

 

I understand what you’re saying , but if the kid is that out of control , it may have been necessary in order to establish control over the situation. Are you suggesting that they should have employed other means to gain custody of her ? Are you a cop ? I’m not and have never been in that situation So I would refrain from judging —AND RIOTING—until more facts are made public . Please don’t misunderstand , I’m not attacking you , I’m just saying that people jump to conclusions too damn quick — I sort of did too when I referred to them as “idiots” , not knowing anything about their motives , right ?And , you sorta called me on it , which is completely legitimate .  But at least I didn’t riot cuz I assumed the police used excessive force when it may have been totally justified !! 

I don't think you're attacking me, and as you know, I appreciate your willingness to look deeper into things. Like I said, there is very possibly more sides to this, and if something extraordinary comes out that changes my mind, I'll accept that. However, they had this 9 year old child handcuffed, with several officers on the scene. I fail to see how she could have been any kind of threat to herself or those around her. I mean, she was in custody, maybe she wasn't complying, but she's a 9 year old child. 

No, I'm not a police officer. I was a High School teacher for several years, and am currently a youth educator. I have dealt with more than enough "out of control" youth, not so many elementary school kids like in this instance, but teenagers. When you have a youth who is in distress, like this child obviously is, you take whatever time and resources are needed to get them to come down. This may take hours and employing professionals who know what they are doing. One thing that will not help is yelling at them to comply, and threatening them. I know that police have difficult jobs, more than I can probably understand. I know I don't know the whole story, but it doesn't look okay to me as the information stands.

And one more time, I by no means think rioting is a just result of any of this. However, I have no issue peaceful protestors who want to express their frustrations.

Edited February 2, 2021 by Splitear

[Northcountryman]

2 minutes ago, Splitear said:

I don't think you're attacking me, and as you know, I appreciate your willingness to look deeper into things. Like I said, there is very possibly more sides to this, and if something extraordinary comes out that changes my mind, I'll accept that. However, they had this 9 year old child handcuffed, with several officers on the scene. I fail to see how she could have been any kind of threat to herself or those around her. I mean, she was in custody, maybe she wasn't complying, but she's a 9 year old child. 

No, I'm not a police officer. I was a High School teacher for several years, and am currently a youth educator. I have dealt with more than enough "out of control" youth, not so many elementary school kids like in this instance, but teenagers. When you have a youth who is in distress, like this child obviously is, you take whatever time is needed to get them to come down. This may take hours. One thing that will not help is yelling at them to comply, and threatening them. I know that police have difficult jobs, more than I can probably understand. I know I don't know the whole story, but it doesn't look okay to me as the information stands.

And one more time, I by no means think rioting is a just result of any of this. However, I have no issue peaceful protestors who want to express their frustrations.

Well said , that , I agree with unequivocally !! 
BTW , I was a Teacher too , for 23 yrs , all high school hbu? 

[Splitear]

6 minutes ago, Northcountryman said:

Well said , that , I agree with unequivocally !! 
BTW , I was a Teacher too , for 23 yrs , all high school hbu? 

Not quite that long. 5 years as a High School Ag Teacher before we moved to NY. There were more than a couple of instances where one of my students was sent to me by another teacher rather than to the principal, for a little "shop time". It's amazing how therapeutic 15 minutes of welding was to some of those kids.  

I work with 4-H now. I don't deal with near the behavioral issues that I did as a teacher, and unfortunately, most of my role now is dealing with poorly behaved adults

What did you teach? I know it was one of the most difficult, but rewarding jobs I ever had. I really think I have the best of education with 4-H, I get to work with kids who want to be there doing things they want to do  

Edited February 2, 2021 by Splitear

[Splitear]

26 minutes ago, 9jNYstarkOH said:

I am not comfortable with it but I am also not comfortable with allowing the 9 year old to threaten their parents to the point the police are needed. I asked you as you seem to be able to see things from both sides not as a attack.

Sorry, I re-read my post, and that was more than a little aggressive. I'm sorry about that, I guess it's just misplaced frustration on my part. Not okay, but I hope you understand. 

[diplomat019]

If a group of adults, let alone trained officers, can’t restrain a 9 year old physically they need to find a new line of work.  I work with 9 year olds.  They might not listen to all instructions but to think 3-4 adults couldn’t physically (legally) make them do what we wanted them to do while handcuffed is a joke. 

[virgil]

22 minutes ago, Northcountryman said:

Are you sure ? I don’t know myself ; did you see footage of the events unfolding or something ? 

Honestly, no need to see what lead up to the point where she is sprayed.  I did see the footage of her handcuffed in the car and then getting sprayed.  Once she's handcuffed and in the car, she's contained and no longer a threat.

[ApexerER]

I will wait until all the facts come out. I have a hard time saying anything negative about people in Law enforcement. I can't imagine why anyone would want to do that job today but thank God they do. There isn't any respect for them anymore. I find it very hard to believe that a police officer sprayed a 9 year old girl for no reason. If he did, then that is disgusting. Unfortunately there are some very disturbed children in this world, just the feeling that you have to call the cops on your 9 year old daughter is disturbing. 

With any of these police "issues" i always go back too, if the perp complied with the officer or officers, there wouldn't be any issue. Since when is not complying with the police a perfectly normal thing.....?  

[Shoots100]

A smack to the knoggin to clear ones thoughts is a lot better than pepper spraying the cruiser that your going to be driving around in the rest of the day.

Still no reason to riot, as the girl wasn't killed and is probably going to be set for life after they sue the RPD, with NY taxpayers footing the bill.

Edited February 2, 2021 by Shoots100

[Northcountryman]

40 minutes ago, virgil said:

Honestly, no need to see what lead up to the point where she is sprayed.  I did see the footage of her handcuffed in the car and then getting sprayed.  Once she's handcuffed and in the car, she's contained and no longer a threat.

If you’re right , then  I would agree , but I would withhold Judgement till all the facts come to light 

[Northcountryman]

44 minutes ago, diplomat019 said:

If a group of adults, let alone trained officers, can’t restrain a 9 year old physically they need to find a new line of work.  I work with 9 year olds.  They might not listen to all instructions but to think 3-4 adults couldn’t physically (legally) make them do what we wanted them to do while handcuffed is a joke. 

And , if they Chose to manhandle her instead , they would rebuked for that too, perhaps worse if it got out of hand. Sounds to me as it was a tough situation all around , and cops were in—as they often are— a “damned if they do / damned if they don’t “ kind of situation . Being a cop is tough , for sure , no doubt about it . 

[Northcountryman]

39 minutes ago, ApexerER said:

I will wait until all the facts come out. I have a hard time saying anything negative about people in Law enforcement. I can't imagine why anyone would want to do that job today but thank God they do. There isn't any respect for them anymore. I find it very hard to believe that a police officer sprayed a 9 year old girl for no reason. If he did, then that is disgusting. Unfortunately there are some very disturbed children in this world, just the feeling that you have to call the cops on your 9 year old daughter is disturbing. 

With any of these police "issues" i always go back too, if the perp complied with the officer or officers, there wouldn't be any issue. Since when is not complying with the police a perfectly normal thing.....?  

Since Rodney King I would imagine