airedale

Vehicle Rustproofing-yes or no?

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Daughter just bought an 2106 Civic, they of course try to sell you all kinds of add ons , I told her and salesman , “these are the most profitable things they sell....”

Anyway she went for undercoating and it’s by Zeibart , they do,some pre cleaning and all that first . Plus it was really clean for ‘16

Idk all my research after the fact shows it’s pretty much unnecessary today  .

If you know me you know I’ve had a lot of older cars , wife’s is ‘04 , other duagher has our ‘ 02 . All very clean even underneath,never rust proofed any .

Always washed my cars all winter like 5-6 times a month , I spend more time under them then on the paint, of course since I retired Iost my heated indoor washing spot ..... I’m somewhat anal, I used two buckets a soap bucket and a rinse bucket. I rinse the microfiber “ spong” after it comes off car and before back into soap bucket, to rinse off any dirt it picks up .

Dont much care for “ car washes “ that aren’t do,it your self ones , many use recycled water, and not all have good systems for cleaning that salty water . Plus do,it yourself I can spend more time under then that brief spray .

I just don’t feel,it’s needed with today’s cars .

ill let you know how the Subaru holds up,in 20 years or so .

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4 hours ago, Jeremy K said:

My buddy owns a shop and says he charges more if a car is oiled ,not sure if that's true or not.

Labor time for repair goes up when I work on it.

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12 minutes ago, Just Lucky said:

Labor time for repair goes up when I work on it.

Makes sense but i'd almost rather work on an oily car then a rusty one .

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My ex worked for Zeibart for a short while and my comment here would be "Buyer beware".  

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I feel the opposite way, i feel like todays paints are brittle, paper thin, and the metal is a lot thinner in my opinion.  I find vehicles rust years sooner then vehicles of the early 2000's to mid 2000's model years.  Thats just my opinion of what I see around here.  I wash my stuff all the time, and am anal with hosing/pressure washing underneath though.  Seems like newer vehicle start rusting at all the pinch welds, and door seams/hood seams a lot sooner than even 10 years ago, or so.  I always tell the guys at work to open the doors, and get those door seams.

Edited by Bionic
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Same here when I wash mine in the winter, I get that wand up inside everything ,the quarter panel, bumpers, i flush out every seem between body parts.

The next morning the amount of gravel and that  black cinder stuff that is left on the floor is amazing . 

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11 minutes ago, Stay at home Nomad said:

Same here when I wash mine in the winter, I get that wand up inside everything ,the quarter panel, bumpers, i flush out every seem between body parts.

The next morning the amount of gravel and that  black cinder stuff that is left on the floor is amazing . 

I know that gravelly sand outline of where the car sat, when flushing out the underside that you're talking about, lol.  

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I have continued on the internet reading just about everything that has been written about rust prevention on vehicles. The consensus is that after market rust prevention either by dealer or specialty shops is pretty much a waste of money on today's new vehicles. Like I previously mentioned the outfits that do rust prevention of course sing it's praises that it is essential especially in the North East where salt and brine  is used on the roads in winter.

Both sides make good arguments and there is probably truth coming from both. I do not put a huge amount of miles on my vehicles and keep them quite a long time so I think doing something is better than doing nothing. My last vehicle was a 2003 Dodge Ram 2500 that I had Ziebarted, it only had 46000 miles on it when traded but it was a total rust bucket in the end even with resprays so Ziebart is out as far as I am concerned.   

I am going to try the "Corrosion Free" rust preventative,  a local outfit does it and it is not too expensive, hopefully money well spent.

Al

https://corrosionfree.com/


Serious Dogs For Serious Work

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12 minutes ago, airedale said:

I have continued on the internet reading just about everything that has been written about rust prevention on vehicles. The consensus is that after market rust prevention either by dealer or specialty shops is pretty much a waste of money on today's new vehicles. Like I previously mentioned the outfits that do rust prevention of course sing it's praises that it is essential especially in the North East where salt and brine  is used on the roads in winter.

Both sides make good arguments and there is probably truth coming from both. I do not put a huge amount of miles on my vehicles and keep them quite a long time so I think doing something is better than doing nothing. My last vehicle was a 2003 Dodge Ram 2500 that I had Ziebarted, it only had 46000 miles on it when traded but it was a total rust bucket in the end even with resprays so Ziebart is out as far as I am concerned.   

I am going to try the "Corrosion Free" rust preventative,  a local outfit does it and it is not too expensive, hopefully money well spent.

Al

https://corrosionfree.com/

I know a guy that has a  20 year old  Toyota stock no rust prevention and still looks like new . And Most people not going to keep a car that long total waist of money 

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1 hour ago, Storm914 said:

Most people not going to keep a car that long total waist of money 

 If a person trades every few years or lives in a salt free environment I will agree completely with that statement. I am not most people, I pay my vehicles off and drive them for years as long as they run and perform properly, I do not like constantly paying a big monthly car payment just to drive something new.

I live in snow country where 200 inches per winter season is common, the roads are covered with salt infused brown slush most of the time and take it from me the vehicles up this way with age on them get rusty from that crap. While new vehicles are not supposed to rust I will take my chances and gamble a couple of hundred bucks or so to keep an expensive vehicle as rust free as possible.

Al

Edited by airedale

Serious Dogs For Serious Work

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24 minutes ago, airedale said:

 If a person trades every few years or lives in a salt free environment I will agree completely with that statement. I am not most people, I pay my vehicles off and drive them for years as long as they run and perform properly, I do not like constantly paying a big monthly car payment just to drive something new.

I live in snow country where 200 inches per winter season is common, the roads are covered with salt infused brown slush most of the time and take it from me the vehicles up this way with age on them get rusty from that crap. While new vehicles are not supposed to rust I will take my chances and gamble a couple of hundred bucks to keep an expensive vehicle as rust free as possible.

Al

Ok your right  so you get more salt upstate on roads instead of 20 years upstate15- 18 years until you see  signs of rust it     . That car I'm talking about has 350k on it and always parked  outdoors. 

They salt the leaving crap out of roads even downstate anyway.  Btw that's a scam I know a guy that owns a dealership who told me that  anything made after 1990 comes from the factory with some type of rust protection. 

Edited by Storm914

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7 minutes ago, Storm914 said:

Ok your right  so you get more salt upstate on roads instead of 20 years upstate15- 18 years until you see  signs of rust it     . That car I'm talking about has 350k on it and always parked  outdoors. 

They salt the leaving crap out of roads even downstate anyway.  Btw that's a scam I know a guy that owns a dealership who told me that  anything made after 1990 comes from the factory with some type of rust protection. 

The dealership guy either lied or didn't know what he was talking about . 

100 dollars to do a whole car in oil is a great deal,I'm not sure what product ziebart is using but rust away and krown are the 2 best oils on the market for rust proofing. 

A car parked outside will always have less rust then a car parked inside where the temp gets above freezing.

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 Not picking on Toyota as my 03 Dodge was about as rusty as what is described below. Hope that Toyota recall put a scare in the rest of the manufacturers to do better when it comes to rust prevention.

 

Toyota has reached a settlement in a class action lawsuit involving owners of various Toyota trucks with severe frame rust. The settlement is for $3.4 billion and will pay for inspecting and replacing frames on affected trucks. It also allows Toyota to avoid admitting any wrongdoing. In total, this settlement could include 1.5 million 2005-2010 Toyota Tacomas, 2005-2008 Sequoias, and 2007-2008 Tundras. Reuters reports that vehicles are eligible up to 12 years to the day that they were sold. The Wall Street Journal reports that Toyota will reach out to owners via mail, notices to publications, and internet methods.

This is far from the first time Toyota has dealt with troublesome rust on its pickup trucks. The company fixed many frames and even expanded its rust perforation warranty on 1995-2000 Toyota Tacomas. That warranty covered over 800,000 trucks. Toyota also had to issue a recall for 2001-2003 Tundras for frame rust. That latter recall also led to a payout of $25 million to Toyota from Dana, the company that supplied the frames. Two years ago, Tacomas from 2005-2011 were also recalled for leaf springs that could rust and break.

Edited by airedale

Serious Dogs For Serious Work

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Have that vehicle undercoated and never regret it. Make sure they coat the the brake & fuel lines under and on the firewall real good as their the first to rot out. I have the vehicle put on the hoist after the first coating. They usually miss spots, and they hit it a second time or I'm out of the deal.

I know some Kia's are dipped, so it flows into areas, spray won't reach.

Edited by landtracdeerhunter
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10 minutes ago, airedale said:

 Not picking on Toyota as my 03 Dodge was about as rusty as what is described below.

 

Toyota has reached a settlement in a class action lawsuit involving owners of various Toyota trucks with severe frame rust. The settlement is for $3.4 billion and will pay for inspecting and replacing frames on affected trucks. It also allows Toyota to avoid admitting any wrongdoing. In total, this settlement could include 1.5 million 2005-2010 Toyota Tacomas, 2005-2008 Sequoias, and 2007-2008 Tundras. Reuters reports that vehicles are eligible up to 12 years to the day that they were sold. The Wall Street Journal reports that Toyota will reach out to owners via mail, notices to publications, and internet methods.

This is far from the first time Toyota has dealt with troublesome rust on its pickup trucks. The company fixed many frames and even expanded its rust perforation warranty on 1995-2000 Toyota Tacomas. That warranty covered over 800,000 trucks. Toyota also had to issue a recall for 2001-2003 Tundras for frame rust. That latter recall also led to a payout of $25 million to Toyota from Dana, the company that supplied the frames. Two years ago, Tacomas from 2005-2011 were also recalled for leaf springs that could rust and break.

To be fair The car I  was  talking about was a  Toyota Avalon .

Anything you coat on a car as soon as it chips off say bye bye to your rust protection. 

That's another reason that it may not make much difference in my mind  . Besides what the dealer said  .   Unless your going to  check it or redo it every few years.  

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Last 2 dodge trucks I had both rotted around the wheel wells. Last 2 chevys zero rust but I only keep a truck for 5-7 years. My 2018 has under spray done and linex so time will yell or it’s the next guys problem 

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14 minutes ago, landtracdeerhunter said:

Have that vehicle undercoated and never regret it. Make sure they coat the the brake & fuel lines under and on the firewall real good as their the first to rot out. I have the vehicle put on the hoist after the first coating. They usually miss spots, and they hit it a second time or I'm out of the deal.

I know some Kia's are dipped, so it flows into areas, spray won't reach.

I agree on the brake and fuel lines, they can be very expensive to fix and can be dangerous.  Why can't they offer an option for rust proof lines for us northerners?  I know it would add to the cost but it would be a solid investment.

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Just now, jperch said:

I agree on the brake and fuel lines, they can be very expensive to fix and can be dangerous.  Why can't they offer an option for rust proof lines for us northerners?  I know it would add to the cost but it would be a solid investment.

Better if the lines were made out of nickle. 

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Just now, landtracdeerhunter said:

Better if the lines were made out of nickle. 

Exactly, that is what I had my rusted out brake lines replaced with on my Silverado.  They are not that much more expensive considering the labor cost.

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Today it seems like the vehicle's selling points are all about who has the most and technological gadgetry, the infotainment center in my vehicles have a whole book dedicated just to their operation. Talk about a driver distraction!!

Spend some bucks on stainless steel, aluminum and chrome plated parts, it would save a lot of grief corrosion wise, one has to wonder if they really want to solve these rust problems. A vehicle that does not rust, that runs well for many years and several hundred thousand miles is probably not in the manufacturer's best interest when it comes to selling new!

Al

 

Edited by airedale

Serious Dogs For Serious Work

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Last year i took my truck to a guy with a body shop and had him rhino line the bottom of the truck about 6" up the body. He color matched the rhino liner and it came out perfect. I also use an anti corrosion product called fluid film on the frames of my trucks and that seems to work very well.

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