PA Girth Chart vs Live Weight Comparison

[Jeremy K]

Why not just weigh the edible meat after you are done if you really need to know how much meat you have?

[Don_C]

I must be missing something with all of this chest girth nonsense... I saw a pic of Wolc with a hanging buck recently, is a $25 scale on that hook just too much trouble? I just don’t get it, not being a dick, but if I were that concerned with what my deer weighed I would have a scale.


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[turkeyfeathers]

2 minutes ago, FatBoyD said:

I must be missing something with all of this chest girth nonsense... I saw a pic of Wolc with a hanging buck recently, is a $25 scale on that hook just too much trouble? I just don’t get it, not being a dick, but if I were that concerned with what my deer weighed I would have a scale.


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We’ve all offered to chip in for one. 

[Don_C]

Dear lord already, I will send one tomorrow!


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[Steve D]

45 minutes ago, Jeremy K said:

Why not just weigh the edible meat after you are done if you really need to know how much meat you have? 

 

13 minutes ago, FatBoyD said:

is a $25 scale on that hook just too much trouble

I have to believe that somehow or  some way it is against his religion or his way of busting balls.

[Buckmaster7600]

Thanks for the additional data point.   Here is an "average"  NY correction factor using our three available data points:
1)  SJ's daughter's buck: 40" chest girth, 180 pound actual field-dressed weight,  PA chart prediction = 144 pounds (- 20.0 %).
2) My gun buck: 42" chest girth, 182 pound actual field-dressed weight, PA chart prediction = 170 pounds (- 6.59 %).
3) Your doe (congrats by the way): 31" chest girth, 117 pound actual field-dressed weight, PA chart prediction = 74 pounds (- 36.8 %).
 
Giving equal weight to each data points, the average correction would be 21.1 %.
For a NY deer, multiply the field dressed weight from the PA chart by 1.21.  That would give my 35" girth button buck a field-dressed weight of almost 120 pounds, probably a NY state record for a "wild" six month old.  FSW probably has a hard time fattening his tame ones up that much behind his fence.  That would also mean that the smaller-antlered, but larger chest girth (43"), that I killed in the same woods with my crossbow last season, had a field dressed weight of 220 pounds.  That would be a record for me.  My heaviest buck, that I had put on a scale prior to this year (and also my largest rack) was 178 pounds.   Like I mentioned before though, weight of a deer don't mean all that much to me since it is always more than 60 % water.  Water has no nutritional value.  Volume of venison is what I am after, and the chest girth method provides a better estimate of that.   
 
In all three cases here, where the deer was put on a scale, the NY deer are heavier than the weights predicted by the PA chart.   Maybe you were pulling the tape measure way too tight on your doe (did you use a seamstresses tape or mark a string like G-man).  My guess is that you got her on the scale very soon after gutting her. That ends up with a lot of water weight.   My buck had hung outside in a tree for about 6 hours prior to weighing and I think SJ put his daughter's  buck on a scale the day after gutting.   Allowing some time for the carcass to dry out gets rid of some of that water weight.  Thanks again for participating in this complicated mathematical experiment. I can give my daughter back her calculator now.

Used a rope I had hanging in the barn then measured it, didn’t pull too tight just got the slack out. Hung 2.5hrs after being shot. Hoping to get a couple more deer this year and I’ll measure them out of curiosity.


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[wolc123]

49 minutes ago, FatBoyD said:

I must be missing something with all of this chest girth nonsense... I saw a pic of Wolc with a hanging buck recently, is a $25 scale on that hook just too much trouble? I just don’t get it, not being a dick, but if I were that concerned with what my deer weighed I would have a scale.


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It sounds like you also missed where I said that weight does not mean that much to me because what you are weighing is more than 60 % water which has no nutritional value and varies a lot depending on how fast you get it on the scale.  VOLUME of venison is my primary concern and chest girth provides for a more direct estimate of that.  I want to know how many quart-sized freezer bags of meat I get from a deer.     I can get all the water I need cheap from the tap.   

Also, I don't know about the accuracy of those $ 25 "made in China" scales which is why I weighed my buck on a "legal for trade", made in USA butcher's balance.

 

[wolc123]

41 minutes ago, Buckmaster7600 said:

Used a rope I had hanging in the barn then measured it, didn’t pull too tight just got the slack out. Hung 2.5hrs after being shot. Hoping to get a couple more deer this year and I’ll measure them out of curiosity.


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I am interested in G-man's numbers also.  He is the one who first brought us the chart and has claimed to get pretty good correlation.  I think his place is much closer to the PA border than you or I which might explain the better results.   

Also, all these "experts" who claim to be able to weigh a deer from an internet photo ought to have a tape measure laying around.  I wonder why they never post any of their own chest girth numbers ?   I finally posted one up on a scale.  That did seem to shut a few of them up anyhow.     

[Jeremy K]

8 minutes ago, wolc123 said:

It sounds like you also missed where I said that weight does not mean that much to me because what you are weighing is more than 60 % water which has no nutritional value and varies a lot depending on how fast you get it on the scale.  VOLUME of venison is my primary concern and chest girth provides for a more direct estimate of that.  I want to know how many quart-sized freezer bags of meat I get from a deer.     I can get all the water I need cheap from the tap.   

Also, I don't know about the accuracy of those $ 25 "made in China" scales which is why I weighed my buck on a "legal for trade", made in USA butcher's balance.

 

It still doesn't make any sense to weigh it first . You'll know exactly how many freezer bags after you're done .

[The_Real_TCIII]

I don’t think 60 miles is making a difference, we aren’t talking Thunder Bay and Florida. My cheap Big Game scale is pretty accurate, I’ve hung weight plates from it


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[wolc123]

1 minute ago, Jeremy K said:

It still doesn't make any sense to weigh it first . You'll know exactly how many freezer bags after you're done .

I agree which is why I don't  usually do it.  I only did it this last time because I had the buck on the back of the van and the scale was not far out of my way on my way home.  I thought it would be a good opportunity to check the accuracy of the PA chart.   

[wolc123]

3 minutes ago, The_Real_TCIII said:

I don’t think 60 miles is making a difference, we aren’t talking Thunder Bay and Florida. My cheap Big Game scale is pretty accurate, I’ve hung weight plates from it


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Do you still have one hanging and a type measure handy ?  We could use a few more data points for a more accurate NY correction factor.   

[The_Real_TCIII]

Do you still have one hanging and a type measure handy ?  We could use a few more data points for a more accurate NY correction factor.   

I do and I will do that I’ll measurement with a string

 

 

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[Don_C]

I want to know how many quart-sized freezer bags of meat I get from a deer. 
 

OK...not being a jerk, but can’t you simply count them when you’re done????? I just don’t get any of this. Why use some obscure way of “estimating” when it so dam easy to know exactly what you are really dealing with?


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[G-Man]

3 hours ago, Jeremy K said:

Why not just weigh the edible meat after you are done if you really need to know how much meat you have?

I know many people who cut their own and do not mess with ribs, shanks, or neck. That is a lot of wasted edible meat. Add damage from a bullet, bone fragments and what you weigh maybe significantly less.  Meat off the hipbone scraps left on. Bones is all edible meat lost .. 

[G-Man]

2 hours ago, wolc123 said:

I am interested in G-man's numbers also.  He is the one who first brought us the chart and has claimed to get pretty good correlation.  I think his place is much closer to the PA border than you or I which might explain the better results.   

Also, all these "experts" who claim to be able to weigh a deer from an internet photo ought to have a tape measure laying around.  I wonder why they never post any of their own chest girth numbers ?   I finally posted one up on a scale.  That did seem to shut a few of them up anyhow.     

I use an antique hog scale for true weight its accurate to within a lbs.  My personal experiences are close to chart, now if you in an agricultural area more than likely your deer will weigh more.. pa is mostly forest poor soils ,ect . Again I didnt make the chart but it does give a way to estimate weight without a scale and give you an idea what you should get back. Again depending on how it butchered and how much detail is given to the lesser cuts of meat. What you can get back will vary..

[biggamefish]

Wouldn't you need a graduated ruler for this? I know when you do tree diameter you use a diameter tape and it had to different measurements on it.

[Five Seasons]

15 hours ago, Jeremy K said:

Why not just weigh the edible meat after you are done if you really need to know how much meat you have?

fine for personal records, but not really accurate for comparison. wound loss, trimming loss. are you capturing flank, neck, ribs etc? 

[Five Seasons]

14 hours ago, The_Real_TCIII said:

I don’t think 60 miles is making a difference, we aren’t talking Thunder Bay and Florida. My cheap Big Game scale is pretty accurate, I’ve hung weight plates from it


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ditto. both dad and I use one of those. $40 iirc and still going strong many years being stored out in the cold garage. Occasionally check with weights as well. Even uncalibrated your'e within 5 lbs in my opinion. 

[moog5050]

I like to do military presses with the carcass and then compare it to what I can do with a barbell and weights.  Its the most accurate way for me to measure the dressed weight of a deer - well except weighing the deer.  We all have our own methods.

[The_Real_TCIII]

I like to do military presses with the carcass and then compare it to what I can do with a barbell and weights.  Its the most accurate way for me to measure the dressed weight of a deer - well except weighing the deer.  We all have our own methods.

What I do is drag the deer. If I get 100 yards (downhill, on snow) before I nearly collapse and need a break I know for certain that deer is under 120lbs. After that ten yards equates to twenty lbs, so if I collapse after 90 it’s a 100lb deer. Take 20% off for every 100 miles south of the arctic watershed obviously


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[dbHunterNY]

On 11/21/2018 at 5:52 PM, wolc123 said:

Do you want the lower jaw from this one to do an accurate age estimate ?  How about the tongue ?

any good deer hunter gets a feel for how old a buck is but i'm always looking at jawbones. hell i have to look at over a 100 every year. i've learned you should easily be able to get between two years and if you send teeth in to compare you'll pick up on other much less subtle stuff to pick one of the two years. antlers, body size, chest girth, and weight can always vary a bit within the same age class. also there's a little variation in jawbone wear within the same age class. even then jawbones seem to be pretty accurate. i'm glad we're up north vs down south with supplemental feeding. back checking with sending in teeth for cementum analysis wouldn't do you as much good.  i've just heard another one on a facebook hunting page to measure the skull from the eye socket to the tip of the nose to get age. i know for a fact that won't work though because i've seen skulls with various lengths within the same age class. always good to keep an open mind though and give a method a chance as Jerry did.

[wolc123]

18 hours ago, FatBoyD said:

 

OK...not being a jerk, but can’t you simply count them when you’re done????? I just don’t get any of this. Why use some obscure way of “estimating” when it so dam easy to know exactly what you are really dealing with?


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The value of the quick estimate is that normally our entire year's supply of venison comes in during the last week of archery and the first week of gun.  That means there is usually multiple deer hanging or in the deer fridge, some tags still available and it makes it easy to see if I should keep shooting or stop.   Once I get up near 200 pounds of boned out meat, I can back off a bit and/or be a little more selective in my targets.    

[wolc123]

2 hours ago, dbHunterNY said:

any good deer hunter gets a feel for how old a buck is but i'm always looking at jawbones. hell i have to look at over a 100 every year. i've learned you should easily be able to get between two years and if you send teeth in to compare you'll pick up on other much less subtle stuff to pick one of the two years. antlers, body size, chest girth, and weight can always vary a bit within the same age class. also there's a little variation in jawbone wear within the same age class. even then jawbones seem to be pretty accurate. i'm glad we're up north vs down south with supplemental feeding. back checking with sending in teeth for cementum analysis wouldn't do you as much good.  i've just heard another one on a facebook hunting page to measure the skull from the eye socket to the tip of the nose to get age. i know for a fact that won't work though because i've seen skulls with various lengths within the same age class. always good to keep an open mind though and give a method a chance as Jerry did.

I finished the euro on this one with the power washer (it took longer than usual so I must be loosing some pressure), but I have not made the skull comparison yet.  Still leaning towards 3.5 but may be a big-bodied 2.5.  The lower jaw cleaned up real good and that did not take long with the washer.  

[chrisw]

I must be missing something with all of this chest girth nonsense... I saw a pic of Wolc with a hanging buck recently, is a $25 scale on that hook just too much trouble? I just don’t get it, not being a dick, but if I were that concerned with what my deer weighed I would have a scale.


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But if you have a scale then how are you going to make up outlandish numbers??

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