Baiting for deer

[gfdeputy2]

Agree Doc like I stated my experiance here is with a small deer population Heck just in 8N hunters kill almost as many deer then our entire state harvest. I think If it is illegal in NY then it shouldn't be done period.

I personaly would hunt over bait legally before other methods like deer drives

[thphm]

I think half the people that live upstate bait their deer. Legal or not.

 

The people that run the above mentioned stores + the local grain stores Love it when the people from down state come up during the hunting season,they are the ones who buy buy most of the grains, liquids and  scented blocks a day or 2 before the hunting season starts.

[pointman]

In the past two years I have seen on nearby State land a large amount of acorns on the ground from oak trees. Have thought about raking them up and using them in the area that I hunt on. Since I feel I would be baiting , so I have  not done so. Just my thought.

[Doc]

The initial intention of the thread was not to discuss who breaks the law and why, but just simply what are your own personal views on the practice of baiting. We know that there are all kinds of poachers who break all kinds of laws. But I was just wondering how you all would feel if it were suddenly legalized. Would you have a problem doing it or would you view hunting successes using baiting any differently than without? .....and why.

[BizCT]

I think it's only a matter of time before NY allows it. NJ allows it, parts of CT allow it, PA allows in some capacity I believe during off seasons, etc

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[Merlot]

I'll never , ever bait for deer . Just something I will not do. My Father and my uncles would turn over in their graves if I did such a thing. Sickens me when I see an alleged hunting show and the " famous hunter" harvests his/her deer over some mineral out of a bag....The one guy and his kids that use that "c'mere deer stuff...just sickens me. Of course, they're millionaires, but they can keep it. I prefer to do some homework and harvest a deer every 2-3 years and be thrilled about the accomplishment.

[Doc]

I think it's only a matter of time before NY allows it. NJ allows it, parts of CT allow it, PA allows in some capacity I believe during off seasons, etc

 

I agree. I think the trend in hunting is away from challenge and more into the "Let's get this thing done and over with". Frankly, I think the DEC is getting in tune with that mentality also as they keep pushing for more efficient ways of wacking deer populations. I think they see a day when controlling deer populations through hunting may become more and more difficult. And so baiting will be getting to be increasingly attractive to them.

[Uncle Nicky]

I've hunted deer over bait in NJ & Texas, and we were allowed to bait here in SE PA for a while (actually, they're allowing it again, but you need to use a commercial feeder and need a landowner permit this time around).

 

It's not the slam dunk many opponenents see it as, as a general rule of thumb, mature deer smell a rat and USUALLY avoid the bait site until after dark.

 

I would hunt over bait again, I have no problem hunting on Sunday, and I love hunting big game and turkeys with dogs. All considered common practice in some ares, but hated in others. Whatever side of the fence you are on doesn't affect me, one way or the other.

 

Edited September 4, 2014 by Uncle Nicky

[Doc]

I think some people do know how to do it and some don't. Those guys on TV shooting out of those box-blinds obviously know what they're doing because for them it's not a question of whether deer will show up in daylight hours, but rather which one of the dozens wandering around munching on the bait do they feel like shooting.....lol.

[Uncle Nicky]

Yeah, guess you're right Doc, some guys just don't know how to do it.

 

Deer Feeder buck killed by yours truly.

[WNYBuckHunter]

Perhaps they should have gotten better sharpshooters. Here in Irondequoit they had very good luck but found the process too expensive to maintain. Which had nothing really to do with the effectiveness of baiting.

 

Remember Doc, in most of the sharpshooter situations, they are shooting these deer at night, not during the day. Thats how they did it in Irondequoit, and you are talking about deer that live in neighborhoods, and are very accustomed to human scent, activity, etc. Completely different than hunting during the day over bait in the middle of the woods.

[nyantler]

I'm sure baiting would be an affective way of taking deer... and if you're into just taking deer and baiting is legal, I guess it serves the purpose as a conservation tool... for me personally.. it isn't about taking a deer... it's more about how... I'm off the charts of most hunters with respect to how much I handcuff myself with my rules for taking a whitetail... I know to some of my friends it seems crazy, but I prefer taking the hardest route to a harvest, not the easiest. So for me baiting is not an option... but I don't have a problem with it for other hunters if that's what you're into... it just doesn't feel much like hunting to me... and there isn't much of a story to tell afterwards...however..I'm sure the venison will taste just as good.

[Five Seasons]

So is baiting the new crossbow debate? Haha. I have always believed hunting should be a challenge. It's what makes it exciting and a huge rush for me. It's also fair chase to me as well. Shooting an animal as it tries to fulfill its natural instinct to survive by eating is not very "fair" to me.

Edited September 4, 2014 by Belo

[WNYBuckHunter]

So is baiting the new crossbow debate? Haha. I have always believed hunting should be a challenge. It's what makes it exciting and a huge rush for me. It's also fair chase to me as well. Shooting an animal as it tries to fulfill its natural instinct to survive by eating is not very "fair" to me.

 

So you dont hunt food sources? Water sources?

[Sogaard]

If I didn't live in NYC and had more than 6-7 days a season to drive 2-3 hours each direction to hunt, I'd never even consider baiting, even if it were legal.  However, because of my situation, I'd probably give it a shot if the DEC allowed it.

 

I only get a handful of days a year to hunt, I'd do whatever was legal to increase my odds of putting some venison in the freezer.

Edited September 4, 2014 by Sogaard

[Five Seasons]

So you dont hunt food sources? Water sources?

There is a point where you use what nature has given you and when you start putting up fences, placing an unnatural feeder, spotlights etc. where you're altering the rules.

Streams, farms, plots that have been in place all year round, funnels etc. do not just appear and alter "nature".

I guess I'm struggling with why antler obsession has pushed so many of us to make it easier to hunt. I know we're not all the same and as a family man my time in the woods has diminished so I do not have the time I used to hunt. Hunting to ME is the pursuit of a wild animal. Now all the scent block, camo, weapons etc do increase our odds for success, but I do not see then changing the habits of the deer. But bait does. Again this is just my opinion, but when bait or fences are used you're no longer really "hunting".

[jjb4900]

baiting is more widespread then people realize....just this morning I was on another hunting website and one of the threads was about 2014 antler growth, and sure enough, guys are more than willing to post their trailcam pictures of deer eating some type of bait that's been put out.......pretty sure these guys are hunting these areas and that's why the cameras are there.

[WNYBuckHunter]

There is a point where you use what nature has given you and when you start putting up fences, placing an unnatural feeder, spotlights etc. where you're altering the rules.

Streams, farms, plots that have been in place all year round, funnels etc. do not just appear and alter "nature".

I guess I'm struggling with why antler obsession has pushed so many of us to make it easier to hunt. I know we're not all the same and as a family man my time in the woods has diminished so I do not have the time I used to hunt. Hunting to ME is the pursuit of a wild animal. Now all the scent block, camo, weapons etc do increase our odds for success, but I do not see then changing the habits of the deer. But bait does. Again this is just my opinion, but when bait or fences are used you're no longer really "hunting".

 

Everything you do, whether it be plant a fruit tree, food plot, whats planted in the ag fields you hunt near, dig a water hole, add a brush pile, etc etc etc can and will change a deer's habits. You being in the woods will alter their habits and patterns sooner or later.

 

In any case, you said you didnt think killing a deer that was eating was fair, I simply asked if you hunted food sources.

[bowaholic]

I'd never do it.  I enjoy the challenge of patterning deer and trying to get them that way rather than sit over a feeder or bait pile.

[bubba]

I have seen baitpiles about a half dozen times in long island. As high as the deer density is here, some hunters can't resist the urge to bait. Its sad. These are probably the same guys who steal your treestands.

What burns me up about baiting is that guys know its illegal, and they know that honest hunters don't do it. But they do it anyway. And then if they shoot something, they have no problems looking in the mirror knowing they cheated the rules, cheated other hunters, and ultimately cheated themselves.

 

 

I wonder how many of these honest law abiding deer hunters stay in the stand and hunt after legal hours? That is cheating also. Are we picking and choosing which laws are ok to break?  I personally would not waste the time to bait.  I prefer to put in my time and scout.  I do plant plots.  some of those are harvested for my cattle  for feed for the winter.  The deer also share them.  I also plant plots for the deer and turkeys.  I do not hunt over the plots, as the deer pattern that also. The most of my activity is after legal shooting hours in my plots.  I use other tactics to get them.  

[phade]

There is a point where you use what nature has given you and when you start putting up fences, placing an unnatural feeder, spotlights etc. where you're altering the rules.

Streams, farms, plots that have been in place all year round, funnels etc. do not just appear and alter "nature".

I guess I'm struggling with why antler obsession has pushed so many of us to make it easier to hunt. I know we're not all the same and as a family man my time in the woods has diminished so I do not have the time I used to hunt. Hunting to ME is the pursuit of a wild animal. Now all the scent block, camo, weapons etc do increase our odds for success, but I do not see then changing the habits of the deer. But bait does. Again this is just my opinion, but when bait or fences are used you're no longer really "hunting".

 

This needs to be rethought and you alluded to it. It's not antler obsession or at least it alone. Reduced time and increasing demands on the constantly reducing free time are a factor. Easier to hunt might be a goal from someone with less free time - and that's an overwhelming majority of hunters. Don't forget most licenses are bought by people who don't hunt that many days. They are a valuable portion of our ranks to help continue our ability to influence things (as much as possible given we are in NY here).

 

I actually think the "easier" part isn't as much about antlers as it is limited time.

Edited September 4, 2014 by phade

[biggamefish]

My thought on baiting deer and I am coming into this conversation late is that anybody can shoot a deer over bait.  You put a huge pile of apples out it changes the deers routine.  I know a lot of camps up north before the season will start throw a bag of apples out to see what is around!!  These guys don't move there cameras that have been there all year.  The only change is the apple and boom they start seeing bucks and big bucks.  

 

  So my thought is baiting is for the guys who just want to shoot a deer and brag not the guys who want to get out and enjoy the woods.  JMO

[turkeyfeathers]

If I didn't live in NYC and had more than 6-7 days a season to drive 2-3 hours each direction to hunt, I'd never even consider baiting, even if it were legal.  However, because of my situation, I'd probably give it a shot if the DEC allowed it.

 

I only get a handful of days a year to hunt, I'd do whatever was legal to increase my odds of putting some venison in the freezer.

2.5 hrs x each way (2) x 7 days =35 hours on the road at prime time deer crossing the road

 

I'd do whatever was legal to increase my odds of putting some venison in the freezer.

 

Rental car with all the insurance you can take out on it outta get you one eventually : )  Kill the lights and you'll get one

[A Sportsman]

Phade, excellent point about free time. Constraints of raising a family, lousy economy, 2 jobs, etc. Has impacted my free time in a major way. Same as it has for many dads out there I'm guessing. We still do the best we can with what we have.

Bubba I hear your point. Its true that in hunting there are several rules which can be bent a little that may not seem like too big a deal. Is your stand 495' from house or 502'. Did you shoot 30 seconds after "legal" shooting light, etc. But to most hunters I think buying bait and dumping it and hunting over it is clearly more blatantly illegal than the other examples I stated.

If baiting were legal, I'd be disappointed. But I would get over it and continue to do what I do, without baiting. Up in forever wild mountains where I gun hunt it wouldn't matter in the slightest anyway.

[Doc]

I knew when I started this thread that there would be a lot of truth uncovered relating to motivations and expectations of hunters and their visions of what hunting means to them. It's all good stuff that confirms a lot of the theories I have had about the evolving mentalities of hunters. What I have found shocking is the number of members that want nothing to do with the practice even if it were legal. A total no-holds-barred attitude may be growing, but it has not yet taken over the sport completely. The element of challenge in hunting is not quite dead yet, but it sure is taking a beating.