An ethics Question

[scolopaxmatt]

You work for a sporting/tackle retail outfitter.  As an employee, you are afforded a generous discount on gear.  Would you consider it ethical to buy gear and resell it for profit?

[wildcat junkie]

What is the employer's view of this?

[jrm]

Would you consider it ethical to buy gear and resell it for profit?

 

No. You are effectively competing with your employer, with him funding the effort.

 

Most employers restrict the discount policy to "for own use," with that sometimes including family. Even where the policy is broader, acting as a reseller is not within the spirit of the policy.

[scolopaxmatt]

A fair question.  Let's say you've signed a "no compete" clause.  The employer doesn't cite specifics beyond this.

[dbHunterNY]

if the employer doesn't have any rules against it then it doesn't matter I'd think.  if they do then obviously don't do it.  the only way I see it as unethical is if someone is set to buy something from the employer but then you say I can get it cheaper for you buy it from me.  otherwise a sale is better than no sale at all.  even as an employee with a discount they're aren't giving it to you at cost.

[scolopaxmatt]

 Even where the policy is broader, acting as a reseller is not within the spirit of the policy.

 

Playing devils advocate here.  Could a policy's "spirit" have any legal bearing?  That seems a little metaphysical for jurisprudence.

[NFA-ADK]

No I would not, you are undermining the business for personal gain.  That discount is suppose to be for personal use, ex: yourself, family and friends, not resale of items for profit.

 

 

[jrm]

Playing devils advocate here.  Could a policy's "spirit" have any legal bearing?  That seems a little metaphysical for jurisprudence.

 

IMO, no legal bearing. However, you original question was on ethics, not legality.

 

Keep in mind that in NYS an employer can fire you at any time for "no reason." If I caught an employee doing this, I would consider it the same as theft and fire them immediately. If my employee needed a written policy to specifically spell out the unethical nature of this practice, I would not want them working for me.

[scolopaxmatt]

IMO, no legal bearing. However, you original question was on ethics, not legality.

 

 

True enough. 

 

So much for entrepreneurial zest.  While I wouldn't do this myself, I can certainly understand others doing so and wouldn't be comfortable passing judgment on them.  I believe our culture at large encourages such behavior, life itself being primarily a for profit enterprise.   

[jrm]

So much for entrepreneurial zest.  While I wouldn't do this myself, I can certainly understand others doing so and wouldn't be comfortable passing judgment on them.  I believe our culture at large encourages such behavior, life itself being primarily a for profit enterprise.   

 

Entrepreneurial zest would be contacting a distributor, getting a business license, setting up a storefront (real or virtual) and selling like a real business.

 

I'm not sure how our culture encourages such behavior. Again, I feel this practice is no more than theft.  If you failed to lock you car, are you actively encouraging theft? Does that then condone the theft? What if the employer didn't have cameras in the stock room and trusted you with the keys to the store... does that "encourage" helping yourself to some "excess" inventory and make it acceptable? It is any more ethical to "take a few home" if it is for personal use vs. resale?

 

An employer giving a benefit to an employee and trusting that employee to not use that benefit to steal from the employer is "trust" not encouragement.

 

Scale makes no difference. It's like the old joke:

 

Man: would you sleep with me for $1 million?

Woman: sure

Man: would you sleep with me for $1?

Woman: No! What do you think I am?

Man: We've already determined that - now, we are simply negotiating price.

[scolopaxmatt]

That's a good one.  I like that. 

 

I didn't meant to suggest that theft or any other criminal enterprise is condoned, only that our "get rich or die trying" society encourages such schemes. 

[philoshop]

Bottom line: it'd be a damned crappy way to treat an employer. Respect is always a two-way street.

[jrm]

I didn't meant to suggest that theft or any other criminal enterprise is condoned, only that our "get rich or die trying" society encourages such schemes. 

 

I see what you are saying, but don't necessarily agree. Actually, I think your statement is contradictory - if it isn't condoned, how is it encouraged?

 

Yes, get rich or die trying is persistent in the culture. However, ethical standards are also pretty clear. Most people who steal or cheat an employer know full well what they are doing, they simply find ways to justify it.

 

While in no way an attack or insult on you, I suspect you knew the practice was unethical when you asked the original question. Asking was simply a way to find justification. No one is perfect - its human nature to look for ways to justify our mistakes, and we all make mistakes.

Edited August 8, 2015 by jrm

[turkeyfeathers]

^{Would you cheat on your spouse/significant other with the 100 % chance they'd never find out ? And why is my print so small ?}

[jjb4900]

^{Would you cheat on your spouse/significant other with the 100 % chance they'd never find out ? And why is my print so small ?}

is there a discount?

[scolopaxmatt]

I see what you are saying, but don't necessarily agree. Actually, I think your statement is contradictory - if it isn't condoned, how is it encouraged?

 

Yes, get rich or die trying is persistent in the culture. However, ethical standards are also pretty clear. Most people who steal or cheat an employer know full well what they are doing, they simply find ways to justify it.

 

While in no way an attack or insult on you, I suspect you knew the practice was unethical when you asked the original question. Asking was simply a way to find justification. No one is perfect - its human nature to look for ways to justify our mistakes, and we all make mistakes.

 

It is contradictory.  If it's encouraged; it's condoned.  Damned semantics. 

 

As I said, I wouldn't do it but I understand it.  I was thinking about a shop I once visited that had gear on its shelves that I was pretty certain didn't come from the manufacturer.  It was clearly new stuff, hadn't been used.  I've wondered ever since how that stuff got there and arrived at the ethical scenario I put forth here.

Edited August 8, 2015 by scolopaxmatt

[ants]

I bet that a lot of employee's have lost their discounts, after employers found out that a few self serving people were reselling for profit.

[Daveboone]

When I worked retail sporting goods, (for a good many years, as employee and manager), we had very generous discounts. It was also stated in co. policy in both companies that the discount was for employee use only. Any breech was cause for termination. Ethics? Simple trust. Breaking the agreement is highly unethical on a simple basis.

[Five Seasons]

Depends on how big the company. Somebody like dicks can absorb it or they wouldn't offer it. A mom and place selling it wholesale as a perk for working there I would say no.

I'd probably just do it for a few friends and family too, not to make a buck. They track your purchases and you'd be out of a job soon.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Edited August 8, 2015 by Belo

[jrm]

Depends on how big the company. 

 

Do you mean company size determines if you can get away with it or company size determines if it is an ethical practice?

[grampy]

If I were the employer, I would not want competition from my own employees. And if I were to learn of such activities, it would be grounds for dismissal. Competition in retail is tough enough against other retail companies.

[ants]

Depends on how big the company. Somebody like dicks can absorb it or they wouldn't offer it. A mom and place selling it wholesale as a perk for working there I would say no.

I'd probably just do it for a few friends and family too, not to make a buck. They track your purchases and you'd be out of a job soon.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

AAhhh ..what?

 

So its okay to screw someone as long as their pockets are deep enough??

 

Its either right or wrong.

 

Would you tell your kids to do something like this, as long as their employer could absorb the loss?…Really??

Edited August 9, 2015 by ants

[sailinghudson25]

Great............

 

Another guy thinking of Jacking up 22lr prices on gunbroker............

 

 

Great.

 

 

Personally, I would do it a little bit, but not in competition with your employer.  However that would be accomplished.  Maybe local friends and family, and that's it.    Maybe sell two to fund the third for yourself, something like that. 

 

Honesty is the best policy.

 

 

[Paula]

I might think about buying something from you once if we were friends, I would then end ties with you or anyone because shows that persons true character. A lying cheating dishonest person, someone never to trust with anything even your word would mean nothing

[landtracdeerhunter]

Selling and price please.