What Do You Think Your Effective Range Is?

[Pygmy]

I won't argue with you boys about archery shots since I don't have a dog in that fight.

However, as far as the military goes, a wounded enemy is more valuable than a dead one, since it puts the wounded man out of action PLUS takes out 2 or three more men who are required to tend to him..

[Adkhunter1590]

I won't argue with you boys about archery shots since I don't have a dog in that fight.

However, as far as the military goes, a wounded enemy is more valuable than a dead one, since it puts the wounded man out of action PLUS takes out 2 or three more men who are required to tend to him..

I can see the idea behind that. But we aren't always fighting people who give a damn about their wounded. Not all care for each other like our boys do.

[Five Seasons]

i haven't read any of the 9 pages, but I can imagine we have some internet robin hoods in here. Shooting at a live, not perfectly still animal while standing on a small platform in a tree, layered in clothes and sometimes cold as hell, knees knocking and no practice shots?

 

I wont shoot over 35 even though i can hit the target just fine at 40... on the ground, relaxed in a t-shirt. It's just not worth it.

Edited September 30, 2015 by Belo

[nyantler]

 

 

Seeing most people replying to this thread have said, again, 30 yards is max, it seems more like people telling bow hunters who take the safe, clean kill, and making sure they kill what they shoot at are wrong.

 

 

I think it's been more about a guy getting jumped on because he feels confident at longer ranges and has been successful. I haven't heard that gentleman say anything like what you've described above. Those saying 30 yards max.. are entitled to that decision.. as is the fella that likes practicing and shooting animals at longer distances.

 

What he thinks is wrong is that you're trying to tell him that he shouldn't be shooting that far... that is wrong for anyone to say and I agree with him. It kills me how some don't want others telling them what size deer they can kill, but have no problem telling another hunter how far he should be shooting.  

[nyantler]

OK you win... Not sure what but... At least we both agree this thread will end up where it started. Nobody changed their minds...

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This thread wasn't about changing anyone's mind... it was about what YOU think your effective range is. I pretty sure the OP knew that the answers would not be all the same.

[PeltHunter]

i haven't read any of the 9 pages, but I can imagine we have some internet robin hoods in here. Shooting at a live, not perfectly still animal while standing on a small platform in a tree, layered in clothes and sometimes cold as hell, knees knocking and no practice shots?

I wont shoot over 35 even though i can hit the target just fine at 40... on the ground, relaxed in a t-shirt. It's just not worth it.

I personally practice with my coat on and at just about every range or position possible, sitting, kneeling put a climber in a tree in my back yard etc. I guess it all comes to how you prepare and what you feel comfortable with.

[DirtTime]

This thread wasn't about changing anyone's mind... it was about what YOU think your effective range is. I pretty sure the OP knew that the answers would not be all the same.

nyantler is spot on. Actually, I am not even being argumentative. A bit sarcastic? maybe. Most of the people here are sarcastic.

 

I didn't expect any answer to be the same. There is a general area where most bow hunters feel comfortable. Usually that is within' 30 yards. I have never once stated that taking longer shots is wrong. If you can do it and be consistent and not loose deer I think that's great.

 

I did question some things, and they are valid questions. If wind can move a bullet 2 inches at 100 yards, surely it will move an arrow more then that. There's also angle. Shooting an arrow from a ground position and from a treestand are different, the POI changes in most cases. Also, even with todays 'super bows', an arrow looses speed pretty fast. So how much kinetic energy is left at 100 yards? Enough to make a clean kill if a rib is hit? I would like to see a few proven stats that lofting an arrow 100 yards at a deer/elk/sheep/ or w/e can be efficient and effective.

[LuckyPickle123]

^^^ AMEN. 100 yards is a long shot for a slug gun for crying out loud...

[Adkhunter1590]

I agree everyone's questions, concerns and even doubts are well founded and absolutely credible. Like I've said before I wasn't a real believer in it either until moving west and spending years hanging around guys who've been doing it their whole lives and considered it normal. All I've ever said is that it's more than possible and requires nothing more than good equipment and lots and lots of practice and confidence in yourself. Weather and animal acts are also a huge impact and need to be addressed on a case by case basis each and every time. There are no 2 alike scenarios when it comes to hunting. No one will ever be standing in the same spot, feeling the same way health wise, be sitting or standing in the exact way nor will the weather be exactly the same. Animals won't be standing in the same spot either. It all comes down to making the decision for that very moment in time.

I did a quick google search and came across this article from field and stream. I'd think we can all agree on them being a fairly reputable source for info. I agree with pretty much everything said in the article. Like the author says it's absolutely possible but not recommended for everyone BUT attempting to practice at such ranges will absolutely make you a better shooter. The article also includes info on the kinetic energy at 100 yards. And if you read it you will see that it's over 60 pounds of kinetic energy with over .5 momentum. More than enough to kill a animal. Take a read I think you'll find the info and hard stats to be interesting.

http://www.fieldandstream.com/blogs/tagged-out/the-science-behind-the-100-yard-bow-shot

Edited October 1, 2015 by Adkhunter1590

[DirtTime]

OK. I read the article. It seems to prove the point of what I and many others have said. Taking a shot with a bow at that yardage is not worth the risk. They were also shooting a foam target that didn't move, has no bones to deflect the arrow on impact and most likely very light if any wind. So, that really only proved what that bow can do, with that arrow and that draw weight. It's really not statistics, stats in my book are using different bows and draw weights, different arrow weights etc to get an average. But, maybe I am nit picking. But we have too as bow hunters. Every shot has to be as precise as possible for a clean kill.

 

 

[Adkhunter1590]

Like others have said before the level of risk is purely dependent on each shooter and their abilities. And yes I don't argue they were shooting a foam target. But their target wasn't purely my point in posting the article. The numbers of kinetic energy and momentum prove what most have questioned...is there enough force at 100 yards to put down a deer. That article clearly proves that YES there is. Their setup is a totally normal hunting setup. From their arrow weight to draw weight. Their draw weigh was actually a tad low of 70 pounds. They even said there was little to no wind. (Which is also the scenario I've stated is the only way I'd take the shot and agree is the only ethical way). Why do you need an average? What does an average prove? The setup they used wasn't a crazy 80-100 pound draw weight setup. It was a normal hunting bow at 67 something pounds if I remember correctly. I think anyone can agree that's probably close to a average draw weight. Bow isn't even maxed out.

I think you missed my point and the articles point. Proved its clearly capable and clearly requires a lot of skill and practice. And that it's totally lethal in the correct weather situations. What more could you ask for without nit picking about a few grams of arrow weight and a couple pounds of draw weight.

[Culvercreek hunt club]

I think it's pretty easy to justify that 60, 70, 80 yards plus is a risky shot with a bow. One that a lot of people won't support.

Put distance of shot on the horizontal axis, and risk on the vertical axis. Draw a line staring at zero and go straight up with it.

Sorry but a 20 yard shot is inevitably a lot less risky than 80. Can't argue with that.

How mad would you be if someone in your hunting party took a shot at your numero uno at long range and wounded him?

I bet if you did graph it that there would be a high wounding rate at very close ranges as well. I have honestly seen and heard of more deer wounded at that 0-5 yard mark than longer distances. I believe the reason is because many hunters don't practice that shot, have a poor understanding of deer anatomy and don't understand steep angle trajectory. The season has started so let's see the posts about the ones hit and not recovered.

 

In other posts on here I have seen comments about the difficulty of longer distance from a stand. First I wholly believe in practicing as you hunt. But given the very flat angle of a longer shot there is actually less of a difference between aim point and POI at those flatter angles. Honestly I would rather have a 20-30 yard shot than one at 5 yards. It is more of a broadside target and easier for a double lung hit.  

[Five Seasons]

I personally practice with my coat on and at just about every range or position possible, sitting, kneeling put a climber in a tree in my back yard etc. I guess it all comes to how you prepare and what you feel comfortable with.

 

as do I. But I know most do not. heck a few hear have even mentioned they dont even pull the bow out until opening day.

Edited October 1, 2015 by Belo

[Marion]

as do I. But I know most do not. heck a few hear have even mentioned they dont even pull the bow out until opening day.

Now that is not being a true sportsman. You owe it to the deer to practice before that shot

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[WNYBuckHunter]

OK. I read the article. It seems to prove the point of what I and many others have said. Taking a shot with a bow at that yardage is not worth the risk. They were also shooting a foam target that didn't move, has no bones to deflect the arrow on impact and most likely very light if any wind. So, that really only proved what that bow can do, with that arrow and that draw weight. It's really not statistics, stats in my book are using different bows and draw weights, different arrow weights etc to get an average. But, maybe I am nit picking. But we have too as bow hunters. Every shot has to be as precise as possible for a clean kill.

 

Stop with the energy argument. Did you read the article? It plainly stated what the KE was when it hit the target.

 

A paper plate is what you have to hit, that isnt exactly precision.

 

If you dont feel comfortable with a shot, then dont take it. If you do, and you have practiced it, then go for it.

 

Id rather see someone that routinely shoots at long range, take a broadside shot at a calm deer, feeding with its head down, or looking away, than see someone who routinely practices at 40 yards take a hard quartering to shot at a deer 15 yards away.

 

Didnt you just say that you werent saying taking those shots was wrong? Now you are saying they are wrong. Cant have it both ways.

[Elmo]

A 300 fps takes a full second to travel 100 yards but we all know not every bow really shoots at it's full specs.  Still, when it's a matter of inches, a full second is a long time.  I don't doubt someone can hit a paper plate at 100 yards in perfect conditions every time.  Let's just hope that when you release the arrow, it isn't the same exact moment the deer decides he's finished with the grass there and takes a step or two forward.  It could happen at 20 yards, I know: I had a doe jump my string at a little over 20 yards but at those distances there's less arrow flight time to move that much when its an unsuspecting deer.

[Culvercreek hunt club]

A 300 fps takes a full second to travel 100 yards but we all know not every bow really shoots at it's full specs.  Still, when it's a matter of inches, a full second is a long time.  I don't doubt someone can hit a paper plate at 100 yards in perfect conditions every time.  Let's just hope that when you release the arrow, it isn't the same exact moment the deer decides he's finished with the grass there and takes a step or two forward.  It could happen at 20 yards, I know: I had a doe jump my string at a little over 20 yards but at those distances there's less arrow flight time to move that much when its an unsuspecting deer.

damned guys out west are so unethical for their shots they take so often. You think that we, more ethical, eastern hunters, could get a movement going to stop the hunting out there? Or maybe outlaw any bow shot over, say, 40 yards?

[Elmo]

damned guys out west are so unethical for their shots they take so often. You think that we, more ethical, eastern hunters, could get a movement going to stop the hunting out there? Or maybe outlaw any bow shot over, say, 40 yards?

 

Everyone makes their own ethics.  I'm not bashing those who hunt.  I'm simply saying what I would or would not do.  It's okay to have a different opinion.

[Elmo]

Meant to say those who hunt out west.

[phade]

Jumping the string isn't going to be an issue at 100 yards. String jump happens pretty much within a very confined yardage range. At that distance, movement in general is more of the consideration.

[Five Seasons]

damned guys out west are so unethical for their shots they take so often. You think that we, more ethical, eastern hunters, could get a movement going to stop the hunting out there? Or maybe outlaw any bow shot over, say, 40 yards?

I don't disagree with your point, but open plains and hardwoods at 100 yards are pretty different situations

[Doewhacker]

My effective range is 99-103 yards and I prefer a running Texas heart shot to any thing else. It's challenging to get the conditions just right.

[DirtTime]

Stop with the energy argument. Did you read the article? It plainly stated what the KE was when it hit the target.

 

A paper plate is what you have to hit, that isnt exactly precision.

 

If you dont feel comfortable with a shot, then dont take it. If you do, and you have practiced it, then go for it.

 

Id rather see someone that routinely shoots at long range, take a broadside shot at a calm deer, feeding with its head down, or looking away, than see someone who routinely practices at 40 yards take a hard quartering to shot at a deer 15 yards away.

 

Didnt you just say that you werent saying taking those shots was wrong? Now you are saying they are wrong. Cant have it both ways.

 LOL! I still did not say it was wrong. I just stated a few factors that fall into play with a bow at those long ranges ( far, far more so then the average under 30 yard shots ). It seems those factors don't seem relevant. Hey, that's fine by me. W/E people are comfy with.

Have at it people.

My point was, not everyone shoots the same set up as in that article. Some people might be shooting 60 or 50#'s and a lighter over all arrow ( in general ). You aren't going to get the same results with the lighter set up. Guess I am wrong for thinking not everyone shoots the same bow, the same broadhead, the same arrow, and the same draw weight.

 

I do apologize for trying to look at all the aspects for bow hunters shooting over 40 yards.

[wolc123]

That is a very good point on "string jump" that very few NY hunters are aware of. Some of them know enough math to calculate how far a deer can move in the time it takes the arrow to reach it, but have no clue of a deer's sound "danger-zone". Beyond about 40 yards, string jump is a complete non-issue. That might even drop to 30 yards if the deer is upwind in a good blow. 15 -30 yards, is where string jump is a big concern. The sound of a bow releasing it's energy from longer range is a natural sound to a deer, not much different than a bird landing or a branch falling.

There have been many times when I have observed deer keep their entire body in the same position for 5 minutes or more. Some examples are when they are eating a favorite food source, like acorns, corn, brassicas, wheat or clover. During the rut I have often seen bucks focusing like a statue on hot does, and have killed more than a few in that scenario, including my 59 yard x-bow buck last season. I don't have a problem with the 100 yard shots if the shooter is confident in his ability and equipment at that range.

Personally, I will keep my shots under 50 yards with my current crossbow setup. I know I can keep my bolts on a pie-plate out to 60 yards, but I am not satisfied with the 8" of arrow penetration I got on that buck at 59 yards last year. Had the arrow struck somewhere other than the heart, the story may not have had as happy of an ending. You can read about what others use as an effective range, but real-world experience is the best teacher. Like Clint say's "a man has got to know his limitations" You won't find those in any book or on-line.

[Culvercreek hunt club]

I don't disagree with your point, but open plains and hardwoods at 100 yards are pretty different situations

Darn. I thought there were a few fields and open areas in the east. My bad.