Are DEC officers allowed???

[mowin]

To go onto private/posted lands without permission?  

Just curious as I mentioned in another thread that I've been checked on posted property before.  No he didn't walk into my stand, but I've been parked several hundred yards off the road in a hidden field and has ENCON waiting at my truck more then once.  

So what are they allowed to do as far as posted property is concerned?   

[Dom]

2 minutes ago, mowin said:

To go onto private/posted lands without permission?  

Just curious as I mentioned in another thread that I've been checked on posted property before.  No he didn't walk into my stand, but I've been parked several hundred yards off the road in a hidden field and has ENCON waiting at my truck more then once.  

So what are they allowed to do as far as posted property is concerned?   

They can and they do if they see any cause or reason they can check and look in any out buildings/sheds but they would need a warrant to go inside your home

[mowin]

2 minutes ago, Dom said:

They can and they do if they see any cause or reason they can check and look in any out buildings/sheds but they would need a warrant to go inside your home

I figured they could, but wasn't sure. 

[ny hunter]

I was told they can... Most are nice guys too...I have run into a few ... They have a job to do just like any L E Officer ... 

[dbHunterNY]

have to have reasonable cause that a law is being or has been broken on your property. otherwise no. if questioned and don't have any specific sure cause then you can accompany them to the end of your property or driveway. that said if you're not doing anything wrong there's no reason not to be cordial and welcome them. they get a bad rep. although some ECO's i will admit make it very difficult to improve their relations with the hunting community, they all aren't evil.

[NFA-ADK]

ECO use to have the ability to check your freezer and refrigerator in your house with no warrant if justified.  Not sure if they still have that ability but a search warrant is real easy for them to get if needed. 

[land 1]

ECO have no special power then any other cop...they need a reason to be on private property a complaint a reason to believe something may be up just seeing some in hunting clothes is enough. As far as going into buildings if they look threw a window and see a violation plain view thats fair game  no searching without a  warrant or consent . looking and searching are not the same  very fine line just saying... but most are great guys doing there job

[Five Seasons]

21 minutes ago, land 1 said:

ECO have no special power then any other cop...they need a reason to be on private property a complaint a reason to believe something may be up just seeing some in hunting clothes is enough. As far as going into buildings if they look threw a window and see a violation plain view thats fair game  no searching without a  warrant or consent . looking and searching are not the same  very fine line just saying... but most are great guys doing there job

I'm not sure this is right. And i'm not positive, but my understanding is that game wardens generally have better access to private property without the need for a search warrant like a police officer might.

[NFA-ADK]

21 minutes ago, land 1 said:

ECO have no special power then any other cop...they need a reason to be on private property a complaint a reason to believe something may be up just seeing some in hunting clothes is enough. As far as going into buildings if they look threw a window and see a violation plain view thats fair game  no searching without a  warrant or consent . looking and searching are not the same  very fine line just saying... but most are great guys doing there job

They are great guys and should be hailed as hero's for protecting our wildlife.  Well said Land 1!

[NFA-ADK]

I do believe you are right Belo, pretty sure they have some other authority that allows them certain access to a freezer for example.  Or to ask you to open the garage where a deer was seen butchered recently. 

[grampy]

A few years ago we threw out some trespassers from the neighboring state land, multiple times, and wasn't very nice about it the last time. Well they called DEC on us, and said we were poachers and baiters. So as we were coming in from hunting one morning, a DEC officer was waiting in the driveway at the farm. He was very nice, but business like. We had absolutely nothing to hide, and gave him a tour of the outbuildings, and barn, which had a legally tagged buck hanging. Told him he was free to go anywhere he wanted on the property too. We also told him of the problem we were having with the trespass issues. He figured correctly, that these scumbags were just trying to get back at us, and he would have a "talk" with them. Well that "talk" must have worked, as we have never seen them around since then! 

We also work with DEC through Deersearch. And he had heard our names from there as well. These DEC guys and gals are very bright and intelligent. They also seem to know when someone is giving them a BS story, or not. We were 100% honest. We told him too, that we appreciate all they do, under very difficult conditions. And understood how he had to check out the complaint. They are our friends, not our enemies! 

If you have nothing to hide, you have nothing to fear.

 

[Al Bundy]

Note: Under New York law, any property that is posted, fenced or gated, no matter how secluded, is protected private property. The unauthorized entry on to such property by anyone, including DEC staff, will constitute trespass. It should also be noted that regulatory inspections should be conducted in a manner that is reasonable. Under the holding of Flacke v. Onondaga Landfill Sys. (127 Misc2d 984 [Sup. Ct. Onondaga County 1985], affd 177 AD2d 992 [4th Dept. 1986] rev'd on other grounds 69 NY2d 863 [1987]), overly frequent inspections of the same site may be deemed unreasonable and give rise to claims of harassment.

 

Sometimes they are not your friends and sometimes though you have nothing to hide, you do still need to fear them. Sorry to disagree grampy, but I have been on the receiving end of unwanted and unwarranted visits from "friends" .  One "friend" also tried hard to intimidate a neighbor into revoking permission to shoot within 500ft of his house.  A few bad apples as the saying goes.

 

 

Edited November 15, 2018 by Al Bundy
Add shit

[46rkl]

Who’d a thunk it? The most definitive post on this topic comes from Al Bundy. 

A very good friend of mine is DEC officer and he confirms that they do not have any special investigative powers. They cannot trespass, search or anything else without observing a crime being committed or a warrant. That’s why they wait at your vehicle or in your driveway. That being said, they are very skillful at getting you to talk and walk. That way they can gather evidence in a legal way. They cannot enter any structure without permission or warrant. They cannot inspect your fridge or freezer without permission or warrant. 

DEC is state law enforcement and works under all the same constraints. Educate yourself and be a straight shooter, literally and figuratively. 

[mowin]

Thanks for the info. I've had nothing but positive encounters with DEC officers over the yrs, and have the utmost respect for them.  

Good luck to everyone heading out for SZ opener Saturday.  Be safe. 

[land 1]

So Al they just picked you out at random.....I get there my have been a false comp. made but they still need to investigate all calls sounds like there may be a little more behind the unwanted attention, Not saying you or DEC were wrong just more to the story.  I re-call on time a group of guys get stopped and everyone was friendly but one guy who busted the balls of ECO guess who got a ticket ....

[BigGuyNY]

Remember there are exceptions to the Fourth Amendment that allow those with Peace Officer status to conduct warrantless searches. 

[Al Bundy]

Neighbors with political ties calling the police when they hear gun fire. Neighbor saying he does not want us shooting by his house. I was not picked at random. But I figured out the law and was ready for subsequent violations of DEC illegally coming onto my posted, gated, private land.    I wonder if DEC investigates every call where someone says "My neighbor just shot his gun.."

[Hunter007]

2 minutes ago, Al Bundy said:

Neighbors with political ties calling the police when they hear gun fire. Neighbor saying he does not want us shooting by his house. I was not picked at random. But I figured out the law and was ready for subsequent violations of DEC illegally coming onto my posted, gated, private land.    I wonder if DEC investigates every call where someone says "My neighbor just shot his gun.."

That's your neighbors fault. sounds like not DEC someone calls they are pretty much forced to investigate.  

[Al Bundy]

8 minutes ago, Storm914 said:

That's your neighbors fault. sounds like not DEC someone calls they are pretty much forced to investigate.  

Investigate.. maybe . Legally? Definitely.  "HI Mr. Neighbor. We checked your call and regrettably, we are unable to enter the property legally as its posted and gated."  No the neighbor didn't put a gun to the DEC head and say "BREAK THE LAW". Neither did the neighbor say "Go to the house over there and demand permission be revoked."

[Hunter007]

1 minute ago, Al Bundy said:

Investigate.. maybe . Legally? Definitely.  "HI Mr. Neighbor. We checked your call and regrettably, we are unable to enter the property legally as its posted and gated."  No the neighbor didn't put a gun to the DEC head and say "BREAK THE LAW". Neither did the neighbor say "Go to the house over there and demand permission be revoked."

You know what happened I wasn't there  . Just speaking generally someone calls them they have to check it out . I would explain to them about your neighbor though being a clown that does not like you and calling just to be a pain .

 

[Core]

Grampy had me until his last sentence, and on that point I agree with Al. Nothing to hide, nothing to fear is a dangerous precedent and reminds me of secret police, frankly.

I'm sure DEC have to abide by the same rules as other cops. No trespassing without cause. A cop can kick your door down and run through your house if he has cause, and he doesn't need a warrant for that.

BTW I've never had a bad run in with police in my life.

[NFA-ADK]

If it was not for them you would see much less deer as poaching would be rampant.  They keep poachers and legal hunters in line, granted we do not always know where the line is as regulations keep changing.  Will you sometimes get harassed by them, yes it happens its part of the sport, if your all legal it should not bother you even if you get a ticket.  They are just doing a job and that job is protecting our land and game and making sure we follow regulation.    

[mowin]

On 11/17/2018 at 6:31 AM, NFA-ADK said:

If it was not for them you would see much less deer as poaching would be rampant.  They keep poachers and legal hunters in line, granted we do not always know where the line is as regulations keep changing.  Will you sometimes get harassed by them, yes it happens its part of the sport, if your all legal it should not bother you even if you get a ticket.  They are just doing a job and that job is protecting our land and game and making sure we follow regulation.    

I've had nothing but positive encounters with DEC. Definitely would consider being checked harassment. 

[land 1]

um if the cops get a call they can come on the landed posted /gated how else are they to make contact with the homeowner  to investigate /interview any type of call , what the cops suppose to send u a letter hay need to speak with u lol , builidings / houses are no go.

[philoshop]

On 11/15/2018 at 12:58 PM, 46rkl said:

Who’d a thunk it? The most definitive post on this topic comes from Al Bundy. 

A very good friend of mine is DEC officer and he confirms that they do not have any special investigative powers. They cannot trespass, search or anything else without observing a crime being committed or a warrant. That’s why they wait at your vehicle or in your driveway. That being said, they are very skillful at getting you to talk and walk. That way they can gather evidence in a legal way. They cannot enter any structure without permission or warrant. They cannot inspect your fridge or freezer without permission or warrant. 

DEC is state law enforcement and works under all the same constraints. Educate yourself and be a straight shooter, literally and figuratively. 

And the DOJ/FBI can't legally break down your door at 4 o'clock in the morning. I'm sure that Paul Manafort and his wife are comforted by that legal restriction that conveniently had a loophole in their particular case.

A good friend of mine is a NYS Trooper who primarily works with the DEC. I call on him often with gun questions because he knows his stuff. He's a good guy. He's told me flat out that whatever the paramilitary NYS Troopers want to do will be upheld in any court in this state. Storm your property, confiscate your guns, take your children away, make you cut your grass more evenly... I have no reason to doubt his assessment. He's been there for a number of years.