Feral Cats and Dogs: would you cull them?

[thunnus]

http://www.dec.ny.gov/pubs/81421.html

Great but old article on the subject.

Cats carry a disease that's transmissible to deer, and absolutely destroy bird populations including but not limited to ground nesting gamebirds.

When in my stand, I kept seeing a white footed black cat and have always spared it not knowing if it was someone's.

Next feral dog or cat I see I will probably take.

What's your opinion? Perhaps better stated would you take one or let it walk?

[ATbuckhunter]

If its feral, I would take them out. I have even been told by DEC agents to take them out if I see em. 

[stoneam2006]

Yes...I've never seen a feral dog and no nobody who has that would certainly be harder than a cat....as as trapper I catch a few cats every year and make sure no tags and are clearly feral before taking action....but cats are a serious problem thru out the state from what I've experienced.

[RSRAINS]

First kill with the New 10 point Venom Crossbow I seen him twice prier and the 3rd time I moused him in from about 120-130 yards. THAWACK!!! 

 

My neighbor used to have 20-30 cats running around and none of them with shots. My wife went to get on out of the garage and it bit her. I told my neighbor we have to find this cat. So I went over to his barn with the Ruger 10/22 we found the cat and I shot it to have it tested for rabies and the neighbor said don't stop now.

I looked him in the eye and said no not here but if they are on my property and spraying on my porches, house and vehicle's it time to thin them out.

 

Edited March 9, 2015 by RSRAINS

[phade]

I have have feral cats at my place that knock over my garbage can. I dont have much love for them. They also rose in numbers as the pheasant numbers dropped. I have a small recurring natural pheasant population (was a preserve in 40/50s) and they are thin now.

[NFA-ADK]

If it was really out of control yes.  Cats and dogs are extremely effective hunters that can devastate an area.  Cats especially with small game, they are the perfect predator IMO.  5 retractable claws on each paw and fangs with unreal athleticism. 

 

It would be very hard to do as I have pets.  Sometimes what you want to do vs what needs to be done has to be considered to help the ecosystem. 

[Lawdwaz]

I won't be getting any praises from the DEC on cat or dog kills any time soon..........................

[growalot]

Before this goes much further...It is illegal to kill cats or dogs in NYS...I do not agree but that is the law and it can carry a heavy fine..

[phade]

The law is boxed in...feral cats are much more common than dogs, but the delineation point is determining feral vs. owned property and that doesn't seem possible. The law won't change any time soon.

 

I've had enough discussions with people who encounter lots of animals whether game or ag/markets ownership, or know the plight of these situations based on their career, that SSS has been pretty much universally recommended off the record. It is a risk, criminally and civil-wise. Not one person ever recommended to me to do nothing in a private conversation. I find that telling. The TNR approach is laughed at by these same people, too.

 

 

Edited March 9, 2015 by phade

[dbHunterNY]

I haven't.  Most of the time it's someone's dog with a collar and tag clinking around from it's neck.  one year I had the same two dogs with collars chase bucks off before the shot during bow season in just one weekend.  I got down and tried to call them in to read their tags but they were all crazed from chasing deer and very nervous.  most people make sure their dogs aren't running wild during hunting season.  I think owner should've gotten slapped with a heavy fine for endangering the welfare of his/her dog.  I know it's not the dogs fault but I was so pissed and saw their condition I honestly thought about shooting them.  Couldn't do it though for various reasons.  Cats are just ridiculous for some reason there's more of them around than anything.  old barns with insane amounts of cats you have no part of is being a problem yourself.  I don't know of anyone who calls them in to a humane society or DEC.

[Curmudgeon]

The laws need to be changed on feral cats. You can't kill them. They aren't vaccinated. The SPCA here charges if you bring them in. The crazy cat ladies are all infected with toxo - probably a cause of their mental illness. This is the same parasite that is affecting deer. Feral cats - all domestic cats - destroy birds, and the prey base of native predators.

 

People should keep cats they care about indoors where they do no harm and are safe. I have a friend who shoots every cat that comes on his property then lays it in the road so the neighbors will assume it was hit by a car. 

 

For more on toxo listen to my all time favorite Radio Lab - http://www.radiolab.org/story/91689-parasites/. Toxo is a fascinating parasite. It makes rodents become attracted to the smell of cat urine.

[G-Man]

I have a old field and stream whose back cover is a full page lithograph , protect your small game! Kill all ferrell cats!! Its.my favorite non--pc add. I'll let you assume what I do as I don't need Peta involved in my life.

[thunnus]

Hey guys: thanks for taking part in the debate. I learned a bit.

If you haven't read the link that started the debate, I'd urge you to do so.

My takeaways are as follows:

I'm not alone in probably not being able to take a dog

While encouraged by the DEC, don't count on their support if the law men find out

Perhaps best to educate neighbors about the risk to local wildlife to let their "house pets" stray.

Perhaps a live catch trap (for cats) is smartest then phone to animal control-let them do the dirty work/euthanize

Edited March 9, 2015 by thunnus

[Curmudgeon]

I have a old field and stream whose back cover is a full page lithograph , protect your small game! Kill all ferrell cats!! Its.my favorite non--pc add. I'll let you assume what I do as I don't need Peta involved in my life.

 

Please scan it and share. I would like to see it.

[jjb4900]

http://codes.lp.findlaw.com/nycode/ENV/11/5/11-0529

I believe this is the law as it currently stands, but as with everything else, do your homework before taking any action.

Edited March 9, 2015 by jjb4900

[Caveman]

I used to be ok with it.  Then my one cat escaped out a ripped screen door we didn't notice.  He doesn't wear a collar or tags since he's an indoor cat, but that means no one would know him from the stray.  He did come back three days later, but it was still sad and had the Mrs. very upset while he was gone.  Now when I see feral cats, with the exception of the ones that have been in the neighborhood for years, I can't help but think that maybe it's just someone's house pet that escaped and they're hoping it comes back.  I can't bring myself to do it after that.  

[Curmudgeon]

http://codes.lp.findlaw.com/nycode/ENV/11/5/11-0529

I believe this is the law as it currently stands, but as with everything else, do your homework before taking any action.

 

According to this, I can legally shoot cats hunting wild birds at my feeder, at bird houses, etc - feral or otherwise. That is news to me. I don't want to shoot anyone's pet but we have had big problems with feral cats in the past. Thanks.

Edited March 9, 2015 by Curmudgeon

[scolopaxmatt]

 

For more on toxo listen to my all time favorite Radio Lab - http://www.radiolab.org/story/91689-parasites/. Toxo is a fascinating parasite. It makes rodents become attracted to the smell of cat urine.

 

I heard that episode as well.  There was a corresponding article written in the NYT Magazine as well.  Fascinating and terrifying at the same time. 

 

I've never been able to see my cat in the same light since.

[Doc]

I know that there are darn few people that feel good about shooting animals that have been bred for domestication. But as a kid, we had some experiences where dogs got into our sheep, and I can tell you that there is nothing innocent, or loveable about a group of dogs that run loose and entertain their instincts from their ancestors. We had thousands of dollars of damage, of the most ruthless sort. These dogs were not killing out of hunger. Not a one of the sheep was actually eaten. Just enough damage was done to kill each sheep or leave them in a condition where they had to be destroyed.

 

The interesting thing about these dogs was that they all were domestic family pets that were allowed to run free and take up some new hobbies. All of them were licensed, with tags, but totally unsupervised.

 

I have also seen dogs running deer and ripping them apart, a bite at a time over long distances ..... not hardly the behavior that anyone assigns to the family pet, but almost always that is exactly what they are.

 

So it's nice to have a soft spot in your heart for the loyal house pet, but don't be fooled into thinking that their calm, good nature as they are flopped out with their head on your lap is anything that cannot reverse 180 degrees when running loose with a couple of neighborhood pals. And the same thing is true of the family pussy-cat that is booted out the door in the morning to simply do what comes natural to them all day long.

[stoneam2006]

I know that there are darn few people that feel good about shooting animals that have been bred for domestication. But as a kid, we had some experiences where dogs got into our sheep, and I can tell you that there is nothing innocent, or loveable about a group of dogs that run loose and entertain their instincts from their ancestors. We had thousands of dollars of damage, of the most ruthless sort. These dogs were not killing out of hunger. Not a one of the sheep was actually eaten. Just enough damage was done to kill each sheep or leave them in a condition where they had to be destroyed.

The interesting thing about these dogs was that they all were domestic family pets that were allowed to run free and take up some new hobbies. All of them were licensed, with tags, but totally unsupervised.

I have also seen dogs running deer and ripping them apart, a bite at a time over long distances ..... not hardly the behavior that anyone assigns to the family pet, but almost always that is exactly what they are.

So it's nice to have a soft spot in your heart for the loyal house pet, but don't be fooled into thinking that their calm, good nature as they are flopped out with their head on your lap is anything that cannot reverse 180 degrees when running loose with a couple of neighborhood pals. And the same thing is true of the family pussy-cat that is booted out the door in the morning to simply do what comes natural to them all day long.

When I was a kid my parents adopted two pure bred labs from a breeder to give them better homes for last year of lives we had them 5 or 6 years and the breeder had bred them right before we took them in. Apparently the dogs down the road could smell them when they got loose and stood on my parents back porch barking aggressively toward them in the room where they had their puppys....my dad tried to shoo them away but dogs came at him. It was late on the night and he came down and asked for my paintball gun after the cops had givin him permission to dispatch them if nessasary and they were in route. So he came and got me and my paintball guns and we lit them dogs up. They ended up leaving cops took his statement and next day went door to door to the farms around until they found the Orange painted dogs. We didn't not file charges about it bc we didn't end up loosing and puppys in the commotion of the mom jumping around and trying to make sure they were protected but the cops did inform him that if it happened again it would be deadly force not paintballs....idk what got into them thay day as I had seen them while riding my bike by his house durring summer and never had them act aggressively toward me...just goes to show as soon as they are away from masters they can change dramatically...

[G-Man]

An escaped cat that comes up to you and wants to be petted is not the same as a feral cat, my neighbors got out show ed up meowing and I was able to take it back home the 1/4mile to its owner, a feral will bolt or hide and act very different to a human.

[NFA-ADK]

I have seen both cats and dogs when hunting.  Shooting them never crossed my mind.  But if the DEC stated that packs of dogs are running deer down and they need to be dealt with, well then I would.  I think cats are the deadliest land animal ever and would not even want to shoot feral ones.  Again if the DEC stated they where killing EVERYTHING and they needed to be taken care of then I would do what was needed. 

 

As a hunter I have conceded that population control is part of what is expected.  Keeping an ecosystem in balance is the results of well managed land, something PETA types will never comprehend.

 

 

[PREDATE]

As a trapper I have had no other choice but to thump a few cats due to them fighting the trap so hard that their feet were barely attached. I got no enjoyment from it and luckily none of the ones I dispatched had collars. I like watching cats hunt and usually lip squeak a few in during bow season. If they're not affecting me directly then they are free to hunt along side me, but I'd rip the throat out of a dog if challenged. I lead the pack! Last fall I was challenged by 2 feral dogs while out musky fishing. They were about 8" from getting my big musky bait attached to their face via treble hook.

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[greensider]

there are a bunch of those cat people around here that build condos for them and feed them they should be eradicated

[Daveboone]

It would help if cats were regulated and licensed like dogs. The next step, (as a prev. cat owner) is getting the cat owners to understand that if it is a pet, it should be indoors, and not outside where it is constantly at risk - disease, fights, cars, etc. Myself, I have had to take "drastic" action against a number of nasty feral cats in our neighborhood. Luckily, coyotes and fishers are doing a great job of keeping their numbers down in this area.