rifle cant center in

[Robhuntandfish]

my buddy has an old 30/30 (i believe Marlin) that was his grandfathers.  We have tried to sight it in and it is just all over the place.  He put a scope on it and had me try it as well.  I thought maybe it was the scope so I put one of mine on it and same thing.  And no rhyme or reason to it.  Left, right, high, low. Get it on paper and then not even hit paper.  I do pretty well at the range and this is so off it just isnt the Indian and is the arrow!  What could be wrong with this gun and what if anything is the best way to fix it?   He would like to use it for hunting for nostalgia sake.  He took it open sighted a couple years back and missed a deer, then put a scope on it and wasnt any better.  And yes he cleaned it a couple of times thinking that might be it.  But it seems like something else is wrong here.. 

[oldkevin]

what range are you starting at? start at 25yards and see if it does the same thing if it does it could be the lands and groves are wore enough it makes the bullet not spin true.

[Robhuntandfish]

Just now, oldkevin said:

what range are you starting at? start at 25yards and see if it does the same thing if it does it could be the lands and groves are wore enough it makes the bullet not spin true.

we tried it at 40 yards and it was all over off hand.  Then shot from a bench at 50 and be on/off paper.  So he should probably look for a new/used barrel?  

[mowin]

Pretty tuff to wear out a 30-30 barrel unless it was abused and never cleaned. 

I'd try a couple different brands of ammo. 

[CapDistPatriot]

27 minutes ago, Robhuntandfish said:

my buddy has an old 30/30 (i believe Marlin) that was his grandfathers.  We have tried to sight it in and it is just all over the place.  He put a scope on it and had me try it as well.  I thought maybe it was the scope so I put one of mine on it and same thing.  And no rhyme or reason to it.  Left, right, high, low. Get it on paper and then not even hit paper.  I do pretty well at the range and this is so off it just isnt the Indian and is the arrow!  What could be wrong with this gun and what if anything is the best way to fix it?   He would like to use it for hunting for nostalgia sake.  He took it open sighted a couple years back and missed a deer, then put a scope on it and wasnt any better.  And yes he cleaned it a couple of times thinking that might be it.  But it seems like something else is wrong here.. 

Has it been boresighted with scope? Take it to gundealer or gunsmith, for appx $25 depending on where you live they will properly mount scope and boresight. I had to re boresight and re mount my scope this weekend, i was having same problem. I boresighted mine 9 yrs ago and it needed a refresh, now i am shooting 1 1/2 inch shot groups from sand bag.

[helmut in the bush]

Do you think it could have been re barreled?

[ny hunter]

Try different ammo...Are all the screws tight on the rifle..

[Robhuntandfish]

4 minutes ago, mowin said:

Pretty tuff to wear out a 30-30 barrel unless it was abused and never cleaned. 

I'd try a couple different brands of ammo. 

we used remington softs, fusion and lever revolution.  We sent prob 4 boxes of ammo thru it and two different scopes

 

1 minute ago, CapDistPatriot said:

Has it been boresighted with scope? Take it to gundealer or gunsmith, for appx $25 depending on where you live they will properly mount scope and boresight. I had to re boresight and re mount my scope this weekend, i was having same problem. I boresighted mine 9 yrs ago and it needed a refresh, now i am shooting 1 1/2 inch shot groups from sand bag.

we cant even keep it on paper on 50 though.  I dont think its boresight.  We havent had an issue with any other guns.  This is just so outa wack .  Might hit high left, then low right, then no paper etc. at even 50 yards.  Something has to be wrong with the gun.  Im no sniper but pretty good with a rifle. 

have heard from someone before that the prior person might not have cleaned it right and screwed up the end of the barrel causing it to shoot like this?   

[sodfather]

Just went through this myself Rob. I’d say pm Larry he may be able to help out 

[moog5050]

Do you know if the gun shot well at some point?

[Pygmy]

Sounds to me like barrel problems ( perhaps a damaged crown)  or something  SERIOUSLY loose either in the scope mounts , bedding screws, or elsewhere....

[Robhuntandfish]

4 minutes ago, moog5050 said:

Do you know if the gun shot well at some point?

i dont .  He was given the gun by a family member.  It was his grandfathers that he never really knew. But family knew he was a hunter and wanted him to have it.  He also has an 8 point mount that was his grandfathers hanging at his house and right now just has the gun hanging with it. 

[Pygmy]

10 minutes ago, Robhuntandfish said:

we used remington softs, fusion and lever revolution.  We sent prob 4 boxes of ammo thru it and two different scopes

 

we cant even keep it on paper on 50 though.  I dont think its boresight.  We havent had an issue with any other guns.  This is just so outa wack .  Might hit high left, then low right, then no paper etc. at even 50 yards.  Something has to be wrong with the gun.  Im no sniper but pretty good with a rifle. 

have heard from someone before that the prior person might not have cleaned it right and screwed up the end of the barrel causing it to shoot like this?   

That is a definite possibility , especially with a lever gun that is usually cleaned from the muzzle...Some gorilla who feels he needs to scrub hell out of the barrel every time he fires a round or two could have damaged the barrel with a cleaning rod..

[Robhuntandfish]

1 minute ago, Pygmy said:

Sounds to me like barrel problems ( perhaps a damaged crown)  or something  SERIOUSLY loose either in the scope mounts , bedding screws, or elsewhere....

Yeah it was almost scary shooting it.  I told him i was done shooting it and it needed to go to a shop to be looked at.  He hung it back up for now, but the gun looks like its in real nice shape otherwise.  Its not all scrtached up and bluing is still nice

[Hunter007]

48 minutes ago, Robhuntandfish said:

my buddy has an old 30/30 (i believe Marlin) that was his grandfathers.  We have tried to sight it in and it is just all over the place.  He put a scope on it and had me try it as well.  I thought maybe it was the scope so I put one of mine on it and same thing.  And no rhyme or reason to it.  Left, right, high, low. Get it on paper and then not even hit paper.  I do pretty well at the range and this is so off it just isnt the Indian and is the arrow!  What could be wrong with this gun and what if anything is the best way to fix it?   He would like to use it for hunting for nostalgia sake.  He took it open sighted a couple years back and missed a deer, then put a scope on it and wasnt any better.  And yes he cleaned it a couple of times thinking that might be it.  But it seems like something else is wrong here.. 

Could be the stock is loose .

And  make sure your  using the same brand of ammo  .

Or even try a different brand .

[Timeless]

Are you sure it’s not a .35?  Putting 30-30 ammo down a .35 caliber barrel would cause the problems you’re experiencing.

[Uncle Nicky]

Tighten every screw, bolt, & nut, especially around the scope mounts. If that fails, put it up for sale. Nothing worse than a gun that won't shoot straight, just more frustration and money spent on shells every time you go to the range.

Edited November 14, 2018 by Uncle Nicky

[Robhuntandfish]

1 minute ago, Timeless said:

Are you sure it’s not a .35?  Putting 30-30 ammo down a .35 caliber barrel would cause the problems you’re experiencing.

lol yeah i checked.  I said the same thing to him when he asked me to shoot it.  I said "are you sure its not a .32 ?"  

[Robhuntandfish]

Just now, Uncle Nicky said:

Tighten every screw, bolt, & nut, especially around the scope mounts. If that fails, put it up for sale. Nothing worse than a gun that won't shoot straight, just more frustration on money spent on shells every time you go to the range.

he wont sell it , it was his grandfathers - would be a wall hang first.  

His grandfather and a buddy got a moose permit one year for maine and they got a moose and never told anyone which of them shot it.  Weve been putting in for the lottery for years and were gonna do the same thing .  His grandfather was from maine and has family up there.  but he would never sell it. 

[steve863]

I would think that the barrel would have to be REALLY bad to be shooting all over the place at 50 yards.  Unless there is some bad corrosion in there I doubt anyone shot the gun enough to get it to be that bad.  Even if the crown wasn't perfect it most likely wouldn't be shooting that poorly.  I inherited one rifle from my uncle where he filed down the crown pretty good with a cleaning rod, yet the gun still shoots well.  My hunch is that the scope mounting was done poorly where the screws aren't tightened down well enough.  Something is probably loose there.

 

 

[Uncle Nicky]

6 minutes ago, Robhuntandfish said:

he wont sell it , it was his grandfathers - would be a wall hang first.  

His grandfather and a buddy got a moose permit one year for maine and they got a moose and never told anyone which of them shot it.  Weve been putting in for the lottery for years and were gonna do the same thing .  His grandfather was from maine and has family up there.  but he would never sell it. 

Sounds like a logical choice, I've had guns in the past that I wasn't impressed or comfortable hunting with, I just dumped them (but was honest with the buyer). But I wasn't attached sentimentally to any of them.

[moog5050]

Other than comments above I will add that I know of 2 marlin 30-30 that shot horrible from factory.  Not off paper at 50 but not good enough to hunt with.  Like softball at 50.    Purchased same at same time so I suspect they had a bad run.    But one would think that a rifle held by the family this long would shoot decent at least.  

[rachunter]

Do you know how to slug the barrel? It should be .309 to .311


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[wildcat junkie]

1 hour ago, Robhuntandfish said:

 

have heard from someone before that the prior person might not have cleaned it right and screwed up the end of the barrel causing it to shoot like this?   

 

1 hour ago, Pygmy said:

Sounds to me like barrel problems ( perhaps a damaged crown)  or something  SERIOUSLY loose either in the scope mounts , bedding screws, or elsewhere....

 

1 hour ago, Pygmy said:

That is a definite possibility , especially with a lever gun that is usually cleaned from the muzzle...Some gorilla who feels he needs to scrub hell out of the barrel every time he fires a round or two could have damaged the barrel with a cleaning rod..

I would be willing to bet that some aforementioned "gorilla" used a steel cleaning rod and destroyed the crown and several inches of the rifling behind the muzzle. The only remedy would be to cut a few inches off the muzzle and recrown.

The only thing worse than a steel ramrod used from the muzzle is a fiberglass ramrod such as I see guys using on their muzzleloaders.

[steve863]

15 minutes ago, wildcat junkie said:

 

The only thing worse than a steel ramrod used from the muzzle is a fiberglass ramrod such as I see guys using on their muzzleloaders.

 

So what do you use if steel or fiberglass is not good??

I don't know, I've seen some crowns that looked quite run down and the guns may have not been tack drivers, but surely had good enough hunting accuracy.  Definitely weren't shooting the kind of groups the original poster is describing here.