? On landlocked land

[luberhill]

I was told in NY state you can’t landlock land anymore ..

and if you own a pc that was landlocked that the owner of the adjacent property HAS to by law give you a right of way across his land to access your land !

[rob-c]

I looked into this awhile ago and from what I seem to remember from my reading,  it can get sketchy  with the owner that your using for access. 

[luberhill]

3 minutes ago, rob-c said:

I looked into this awhile ago and from what I seem to remember from my reading,  it can get sketchy  with the owner that your using for access. 

But the question remains ... IF the landlocked owner is willing to go to court would the other property owner HAVE to give access under necessity if need ?

[rob-c]

4 minutes ago, luberhill said:

But the question remains ... IF the landlocked owner is willing to go to court would the other property owner HAVE to give access under necessity if need ?

I want to say yes, but I looked it up some time ago. Google it, pretty sure I found hours of reading on it. 

[ncountry]

Nomads response from a few years ago 

 

 

"Ok lawyer called back yes you have to be able to access your land in NYS via easement by necessity . But he would not pay one dollar for such land....

Now I got lost in all the legal talk , but he would want to see evidentiary proof of an existing easement. If you had to establish one plan on spending a ton of cash.

Name all adjoining land owners sue them for the easement , you show best route based upon distance , topography and so forth . He went on for several more minutes but youget the point."

[biggamefish]

You have to be able to access your land in NYS. Easements can go from easy 20 ft wide along the east property line to the property. To stupid complicated. Best thing to do in a situation like this is to buy a strip of land to access from an adjacent land owner.That way it is clear and nothing can stop you.  

[Daveboone]

We used to spend quite a bit of time watching the areas county tax sales (for real estate). Several times we looked at chunks of land that were "landlocked". It is up to the buyer to determine if there is a historical access and to obtain a right of way. The surrounding landowners have no obligation to surrender non historic access through their land...that was per a conversation with one of the clerks...a lawyer, at the Oswego County Clerks office.

[mowin]

14 minutes ago, biggamefish said:

You have to be able to access your land in NYS. Easements can go from easy 20 ft wide along the east property line to the property. To stupid complicated. Best thing to do in a situation like this is to buy a strip of land to access from an adjacent land owner.That way it is clear and nothing can stop you.  

It's not that easy. Most landowners will tell you no frigging way will we sell a sliver of our land to anyone. 

Edited February 17, 2021 by mowin

[mowin]

Dbl post

Edited February 17, 2021 by mowin

[Farflung]

lots of "if's" involved with landlocked property. Often revolves in part on how the title to the property evolved. It can be very close to a road on one side, but have came out of a great lot on the other side of the property that is a swamp. If you obtain access, it may come accross the swamp. Usually better to purchase a R.O.W. from a neighboring piece or look for another piece of land.

[luberhill]

29 minutes ago, ncountry said:

Nomads response from a few years ago 

 

 

"Ok lawyer called back yes you have to be able to access your land in NYS via easement by necessity . But he would not pay one dollar for such land....

Now I got lost in all the legal talk , but he would want to see evidentiary proof of an existing easement. If you had to establish one plan on spending a ton of cash.

Name all adjoining land owners sue them for the easement , you show best route based upon distance , topography and so forth . He went on for several more minutes but youget the point."

The guy that owns the landlocked pc was left to him about 15 years ago from his grandfather.

He approached the owners on both sides and offered to buy a pc so he can access his ..

Both owners said no !

Now he wants to peruse it ..

he wants to build on it but I don’t see that being possible due to the layout ..

I guess if you have enough money anything is possible 

[luberhill]

6 minutes ago, mowin said:

It's not that easy. Most landowners will tell you no frigging way will we sell a sliver of our land to anyone. 

Yup but the way it looks the courts will force them to give the landlocked owner a ROW

[luberhill]

8 minutes ago, mowin said:

It's not that easy. Most landowners will tell you no frigging way will we sell a sliver of our land to anyone. 

Again... he tried that , both owners said no !

They don’t want anyone building next to them 

[moog5050]

It’s complicated and relates to how the property became landlocked.   It’s not as simple as you need an easement so the adjacent owner must give it.   

[Nomad]

I’m not sure I’d take land locked land for free .

I know people who’ve owned land locked land , a nightmare,  lawyer fees, and years of battles .

My good friend lives on a private road above the bay , four homes with access to the water with shared dock .

The man who owned the land and sold off the four homes lots , kept a silver of land along the bay ,with zero access to,it , he’s now trying to sell it . My buddy constantly deals with realtors and clients trying to access it by parking in his driveway and walking through his yard . 
 

There is no access,no place to park let alone, walk to the land . The dope should have kept a right a way ,but he didn’t , I guess one could go by boat . 
 

I found land locked land in the town of Victor , I drive past it on the way to my land . I knew it would be good hunting , and a shorter drive ,and I could access it across a RR track ,still no way even for cheap .

 

[phantom]

a little off topic but what about  land locked land state land ?  is there always a way to get to it even if its not advertised easement  to the public 

[luberhill]

42 minutes ago, moog5050 said:

It’s complicated and relates to how the property became landlocked.   It’s not as simple as you need an easement so the adjacent owner must give it.   

I guess the entire farm was owned by his grandfather years ago , he died and they sold the farm but this parcel that was landlocked went to this guy .

 

[BowmanMike]

8 hours ago, phantom said:

a little off topic but what about  land locked land state land ?  is there always a way to get to it even if its not advertised easement  to the public 

Nope,you need to access it legally. If there is no right of way you need adjacent landowners permission.

If you can't get that you can't access the state land.

Edited February 17, 2021 by BowmanMike

[Daveboone]

perhaps if you already own the land, the best approach would be to contact surrounding land owners and see if they want to buy it for a realistic price (taking into account it is basically worthless to you if you cant access it).

[Geno C]

Are you asking about prior land locked land or if a land owner was to to a parcel split or mini subdivision split today?

If land has been land locked for instance, 20 years, an adjacent land owner is not required by law to give access to the land locked land. 

 

If a land owner is subdividing their land and looking to sell and the parcel is locked, that owner would have to provide access to that new parcel. It can not be locked and no attorney will allow a client to purchase the new land if it was locked with a hand shake for access without there being a ROW that conveys or something in writing.  

There is no law to my knowledge that requires a adjoining land owner to provide access to a land locked parcel behind them that have been locked since the split dating back how ever long. People buy land locked land all the time at tax auctions, their attorney can not strong arm a adjoining parcel to provide that buyer access..  That land locked owner from tax auction would now have to find every owner with road frontage and start trying to sweet talk a deal and purchase a ROW. Once a ROW is in place it can often be looked at as a negative for resale, once you give access to a lot behind you, you become a Servient Tenant making the land locked lot the Dominant Tenant and can use that access when ever and bow ever they want.

[luberhill]

1 hour ago, Geno C said:

Are you asking about prior land locked land or if a land owner was to to a parcel split or mini subdivision split today?

If land has been land locked for instance, 20 years, an adjacent land owner is not required by law to give access to the land locked land. 

 

If a land owner is subdividing their land and looking to sell and the parcel is locked, that owner would have to provide access to that new parcel. It can not be locked and no attorney will allow a client to purchase the new land if it was locked with a hand shake for access without there being a ROW that conveys or something in writing.  

There is no law to my knowledge that requires a adjoining land owner to provide access to a land locked parcel behind them that have been locked since the split dating back how ever long. People buy land locked land all the time at tax auctions, their attorney can not strong arm a adjoining parcel to provide that buyer access..  That land locked owner from tax auction would now have to find every owner with road frontage and start trying to sweet talk a deal and purchase a ROW. Once a ROW is in place it can often be looked at as a negative for resale, once you give access to a lot behind you, you become a Servient Tenant making the land locked lot the Dominant Tenant and can use that access when ever and bow ever they want.

Yea this land has been landlocked over 20 years but according to the owner he said his attorney told him one of the adjacent landowners HAS to give him access in NY state ??

[Geno C]

7 minutes ago, luberhill said:

Yea this land has been landlocked over 20 years but according to the owner he said his attorney told him one of the adjacent landowners HAS to give him access in NY state ??

A land owner does not HAVE to do anything like that. If a purchaser buys land locked land willingly and does not do their own due diligence, that's on them... They DO have the right to try and negotiate a ROW from any bordering land owner but any land owner who owns that property in its entirety does not have to provide access to the land locked land.    

Unless this is a law just passed this month, Ive never heard anything like that. I have created subdivisions, split parcels, rezoned land, had to be in front of the planning board and ZBA many times and Ive never heard of a law requiring a land owner to provide  access. 

I can give my attorney a shout and ask him tho.

[luberhill]

7 minutes ago, Geno C said:

A land owner does not HAVE to do anything like that. If a purchaser buys land locked land willingly and does not do their own due diligence, that's on them... They DO have the right to try and negotiate a ROW from any bordering land owner but any land owner who owns that property in its entirety does not have to provide access to the land locked land.    

Unless this is a law just passed this month, Ive never heard anything like that. I have created subdivisions, split parcels, rezoned land, had to be in front of the planning board and ZBA many times and Ive never heard of a law requiring a land owner to provide  access. 

I can give my attorney a shout and ask him tho.

Yea ask him because this guys attorney IS a real estate attorney and said NOW ? In NY state every land owner with land locked land has the right of necessity ? to access their land .

If the surrounding landowner will not sell a ROW of a strip they will be forced to.

This guy inherited the land over 20 yrs ago from his grandfather .

I hunt that land and am friends with the surrounding landowner .

It’s basically a huge gorge ..I’ve killed a few deer but getting them out is never easy . 
Let me know what you find out 

Thx

 

 

 

[Steuben Jerry]

1 minute ago, luberhill said:

Yea ask him because this guys attorney IS a real estate attorney and said NOW ? In NY state every land owner with land locked land has the right of necessity ? to access their land .

If the surrounding landowner will not sell a ROW of a strip they will be forced to.

This guy inherited the land over 20 yrs ago from his grandfather .

I hunt that land and am friends with the surrounding landowner .

It’s basically a huge gorge ..I’ve killed a few deer but getting them out is never easy . 
Let me know what you find out 

Thx

I can say from personal experience this isn't the case or at least it wasn't if some new laws passed recently.

I'm pretty sure I've told this story, but here's a condensed version. Back in the early 1980's, behind the property I now own, a couple from Rochester bid at tax auction, on two parcels of land. This was part of an estate that had 5-10 adjoining parcels and the other parcels that were on frontage sold during the auction (not to them). They bought two land-locked parcels and spent the next 20+ years trying to convince the surrounding landowners to give them a right of way. Everybody said no, and the purchasers trespassed their way in until the neighbors put a stop to it. When I bought a neighboring parcel they approached me - with a terrible style to boot. They told me I had to give them a right of way for free as they claimed "easement of necessity", but they of course were willing to cover my legal costs. How generous. I told them to get lost and they proceeded to trespass on me until I (DEC) put a stop to that.

According to the surviving widow of the couple, they spent over $20 grand on trying to gain access before they gave up. They found no legal recourse in over 25 years to gain access. Maybe they should have just bought a helicopter.

[luberhill]

7 minutes ago, Steuben Jerry said:

I can say from personal experience this isn't the case or at least it wasn't if some new laws passed recently.

I'm pretty sure I've told this story, but here's a condensed version. Back in the early 1980's, behind the property I now own, a couple from Rochester bid at tax auction, on two parcels of land. This was part of an estate that had 5-10 adjoining parcels and the other parcels that were on frontage sold during the auction (not to them). They bought two land-locked parcels and spent the next 20+ years trying to convince the surrounding landowners to give them a right of way. Everybody said no, and the purchasers trespassed their way in until the neighbors put a stop to it. When I bought a neighboring parcel they approached me - with a terrible style to boot. They told me I had to give them a right of way for free as they claimed "easement of necessity", but they of course were willing to cover my legal costs. How generous. I told them to get lost and they proceeded to trespass on me until I (DEC) put a stop to that.

According to the surviving widow of the couple, they spent over $20 grand on trying to gain access before they gave up. They found no legal recourse in over 25 years to gain access. Maybe they should have just bought a helicopter.

Well for sure he is getting different info from his attorney