Crossbow Failed Again

[grampy]

15 minutes ago, Belo said:

So here's the rub sir. It's not legal to hunt with a crossbow the first few weeks a year, so why do yall care what us bowhunters are doing? It's legal.

Yet here we have a thread and a coalition trying to change what is legal. Do you see what I did there? Do you not see the irony in your statement?

So.....why do you care if someone wants to hunt with a crossbow Oct. 1st??? Won't effect what YOU do, right???

 

The coalition is looking to change the law, to accept changes. Just like what was done when compound bows were deemed legal, alongside traditional bows. Quite simply, the argument is the same.

 

 

[stubborn1VT]

2 hours ago, Belo said:

~15 in the ~15 years I've used a bow. 2 years ago with my brand new Matthews (2nd bow I've ever owned) was the first time I wounded (not lethally) a doe. Go figure.

Doesn't sound that challenging to me.

[Robhuntandfish]

1 hour ago, Steuben Jerry said:

The neighbor wondering what I have in my tree stand with me..

so why is she looking into the window and not out??hmmm   i think there is more to the story your not telling us.....

[Jeremy K]

1 hour ago, grampy said:

So.....why do you care if someone wants to hunt with a crossbow Oct. 1st??? Won't effect what YOU do, right???

 

The coalition is looking to change the law, to accept changes. Just like what was done when compound bows were deemed legal, alongside traditional bows. Quite simply, the argument is the same.

 

 

The belong in gun season with the other shoulder fired implements. 

[Five Seasons]

1 hour ago, grampy said:

So.....why do you care if someone wants to hunt with a crossbow Oct. 1st??? Won't effect what YOU do, right???

 

The coalition is looking to change the law, to accept changes. Just like what was done when compound bows were deemed legal, alongside traditional bows. Quite simply, the argument is the same.

 

 

Who cares what I hunt with as long as it's legal?

Such a shitty response isn't it? A guy has hunted for a year or 2 with a compound and makes a comment like that... misses the point entirely. 

Edited May 5, 2021 by Belo

[grampy]

6 minutes ago, Belo said:

Who cares what I hunt with as long as it's legal?

My point exactly!!! Thank You!

[Gobbler Chaser]

4 hours ago, Belo said:

I'll add this one separate and because Fred says it better than I ever will.

“Here we have a weapon of beauty and romance. He who shoots with a bow, puts his life’s energy into it. The force behind the flying shaft must be placed there by the archer. At the moment of greatest strain he must draw every sinew to the utmost; his hand must be steady; his nerves under absolute control; his eye keen and clear. In the hunt he pits his well-trained skill against the instinctive cunning of his quarry. By the most adroit cleverness, he must approach within striking distance, and when he speeds his low whispering shaft and strikes his game, he has won by the strength of arm and nerve. It is a noble sport.”

What a crock of Dung

[airedale]

15 minutes ago, Gobbler Chaser said:

What a crock of Dung

A matter of opinion, I for one agree with Fred's whole statement.

Al

Edited May 5, 2021 by airedale

[Gobbler Chaser]

49 minutes ago, airedale said:

A matter of opinion, I for one agree with Fred's whole statement.

Al

I agree too. I was directing my statement at the guy quoting it.

[Steve D]

I personally have nothing against crossbows but have no desire whatsoever to hunt with one. I would think that any of us that bow and gun hunt would would admit there is a significant difference between the two seasons.

My biggest issue is ones that have never hunted during bow season suddenly being able to hunt the bow season with a crossbow bringing more hunters into the woods.  I like bow season because I see a lot less hunters and the deer are  not as pressured because of that reason.

Another issue for me are the ones like my brother in law that doesn't want to put the time in practicing and getting prepared for bow season with a compound. He wants crossbow to pass just for that reason. For him it is easier and a lot less effort.

Should a "gun" hunter be allowed to hunt during "bow" season with a crossbow??  Not for me to decide. I still think we should all be issued so many tags, have the season run the length  the DEC wants it to;  and be able to fill those tags any time during the open season with the legal weapon of one's choice.

If I was able to make a harvest in Oct. with a rife, one in Nov. with a pistol, and one in Dec. with a bow who would it hurt? If I filled all three of my tags in Oct., Nov., or Dec., what's the difference? Deer season is deer season...who cares what you harvest them with or when they are harvested?

Edited May 5, 2021 by Steve D

[BizCT]

So here's the rub sir. It's not legal to hunt with a crossbow the first few weeks a year, so why do yall care what us bowhunters are doing? It's legal.
Yet here we have a thread and a coalition trying to change what is legal. Do you see what I did there? Do you not see the irony in your statement?

Right. But if it becomes legal, life goes on like it did in every other state.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

[Five Seasons]

22 hours ago, grampy said:

My point exactly!!! Thank You!

so if it isn't legal, leave it alone eh?

21 hours ago, Gobbler Chaser said:

What a crock of Dung

Hell of a contribution and rebuttal. The godfather of modern archery eloquently explains the sport and that's your response? Once again I'm here asking for a reason other than disability and support of manufacturers exactly WHY we should allow crossbows. All I ever hear is why my reasons for not allowing them aren't ok.

21 hours ago, Gobbler Chaser said:

I agree too. I was directing my statement at the guy quoting it.

so come at me bro. 

[Five Seasons]

17 hours ago, Biz-R-OWorld said:

 

Right. But if it becomes legal, life goes on like it did in every other state.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

 

sure and I've said that if and when it happens it wont be any sweat off my balls, but until then I can voice my opposition to it. Your "so long as its legal, who cares" confuses me. It's not legal and vertical bows are. So why does it bother you? We will continue to have a growing archery season like we have had forever and life goes on.

[Five Seasons]

20 hours ago, Steve D said:

I personally have nothing against crossbows but have no desire whatsoever to hunt with one. I would think that any of us that bow and gun hunt would would admit there is a significant difference between the two seasons.

My biggest issue is ones that have never hunted during bow season suddenly being able to hunt the bow season with a crossbow bringing more hunters into the woods.  I like bow season because I see a lot less hunters and the deer are  not as pressured because of that reason.

Another issue for me are the ones like my brother in law that doesn't want to put the time in practicing and getting prepared for bow season with a compound. He wants crossbow to pass just for that reason. For him it is easier and a lot less effort.

Should a "gun" hunter be allowed to hunt during "bow" season with a crossbow??  Not for me to decide. I still think we should all be issued so many tags, have the season run the length  the DEC wants it to;  and be able to fill those tags any time during the open season with the legal weapon of one's choice.

If I was able to make a harvest in Oct. with a rife, one in Nov. with a pistol, and one in Dec. with a bow who would it hurt? If I filled all three of my tags in Oct., Nov., or Dec., what's the difference? Deer season is deer season...who cares what you harvest them with or when they are harvested?

i wish I could fill both buck tags with archery. I think the argument is that we would then be shooting "their deer" and by their I mean gun hunters. They're already pissed as it is that we have the rut and have already eroded the season by getting the last archery weekend and a youth weekend in exchange for 2 mosquito weeks.

[Steve D]

2 hours ago, Belo said:

I think the argument is that we would then be shooting "their deer" and by their I mean gun hunters.

The way the seasons are right now I can understand how they would feel that way. As it is now a lot of gun hunters are mad because some of the real nice bucks are taken during bow.  Just because they choose to gun hunt instead of bow for whatever reason they should not be denied the opportunity to shoot a nice buck.

 On the other hand If I was trying to get in bow range of a nice buck and someone shot it with a rifle 100 yds. away I would be irritated to. No "easy" solution.

[BizCT]

3 hours ago, Belo said:

sure and I've said that if and when it happens it wont be any sweat off my balls, but until then I can voice my opposition to it. Your "so long as its legal, who cares" confuses me. It's not legal and vertical bows are. So why does it bother you? We will continue to have a growing archery season like we have had forever and life goes on.

I mostly stay out of threads. It's a pointless debate after everyone says the same things for 7 years was my point.

[Five Seasons]

15 hours ago, Steve D said:

The way the seasons are right now I can understand how they would feel that way. As it is now a lot of gun hunters are mad because some of the real nice bucks are taken during bow.  Just because they choose to gun hunt instead of bow for whatever reason they should not be denied the opportunity to shoot a nice buck.

 On the other hand If I was trying to get in bow range of a nice buck and someone shot it with a rifle 100 yds. away I would be irritated to. No "easy" solution.

I agree with you 100% there is no easy solution other than to get off your ass and learn to archery hunt. It's not a whole lot different than the guy who is a hardcore fisherman than the one who casually fishes a few weekends a year. You get out of life what you put into it.

[Doc]

All this makes you wonder why we have ANY "special" seasons" at all? Why not just have "Deer Season", and use any weapon you want? Isn't that what crossbow hunters really want anyway? Some of you crossbow proponents must kind of have that feeling. Why do you want to exclude guns from a certain part of the deer season. Isn't that a bit of an elitist and exclusionary attitude and perhaps showing a bit of selfishness? Let's really open up bow season and stop hogging up the woods for the elitist bow and crossbow hunters. I know a lot of rifle hunters that would love to have that nice warm part of the year to use their guns on deer.

Of course I say all this with tongue-cheek, but when you listen to the arguments for demanding full inclusion of crossbows, that thought of an "any-weapon" deer season has to cross your mind.

[wolc123]

1 hour ago, Doc said:

All this makes you wonder why we have ANY "special" seasons" at all? Why not just have "Deer Season", and use any weapon you want? Isn't that what crossbow hunters really want anyway? Some of you crossbow proponents must kind of have that feeling. Why do you want to exclude guns from a certain part of the deer season. Isn't that a bit of an elitist and exclusionary attitude and perhaps showing a bit of selfishness? Let's really open up bow season and stop hogging up the woods for the elitist bow and crossbow hunters. I know a lot of rifle hunters that would love to have that nice warm part of the year to use their guns on deer.

Of course I say all this with tongue-cheek, but when you listen to the arguments for demanding full inclusion of crossbows, that thought of an "any-weapon" deer season has to cross your mind.

The reasons for the special seasons is that it allows for a greater deer harvest while satisfying the desires of more hunters.   Both of these are important.    Maybe you have not noticed the effect of the noise of a gun, coupled with hunting pressure in the areas you hunt.  I always see that make the bulk of the local deer herd switch to basically full nocturnal activity.  Elimination of those early "silent seasons" would greatly reduce the chances for hunters to even see deer, let alone kill them.   The crossbow, being silent like the vertical bow, would not alter the current situation, as far as the gunfire effect on deer daylight/nocturnal behavior.

I believe that those who put forth the added effort to develop proficiency in traditional archery do deserve some extra early time, but that should certainly not apply to the compound bow.   Would you be ok with a 99.9999 % letoff compound bow ?  A good archery deer season would be: "Traditional" (recurve/longbow) October 1 thru October 14, "Modern" (compound/crossbow) October 15 thru opening of gun season.

[Gobbler Chaser]

I really have to wonder why anti crossbowers believe that the sky would immediately fall following full inclusion when it hasn't done any such thing in any other state around us. 

[Foggy Mountain]

5 minutes ago, Gobbler Chaser said:

I really have to wonder why anti crossbowers believe that the sky would immediately fall following full inclusion when it hasn't done any such thing in any other state around us. 

Horsedung. It’s happened in a state right next door.  I don’t even hunt the state I live in because of it. Least not most places and very limited there. Once we had a real nice herd. 
Yes The liberal bag limits hurt that, baiting also doesn’t help but I’m sure some girls in NY can’t kill deer by not baiting as well. You only need to look at sporting goods stores mid state selling all the bait. 
The crossbow thing that’s most problematic is they bring firearm mentality into a season that doesn’t need it. 
One spot on the federal land I hunted for years is lined up with guys driving from minute one of opening day. They drive by you all day long just as in firearm season. How can you bowhunt there? You can’t, gotta move, than guys show up there, gotta move again. 
They also wish things easier and easier. Look at the crossgun shoots 2 bolts. The ten point garmin set that ranges for you. Raven claiming 100 yards. I’ll be honest any bow can do that. Surely any crossbow but the hang time of the arrow is just too long resulting in wounded deer. 
Firearm guys can learn for sure but they don’t want to learn, they want things easy. God almighty NY firearm is super easy and early enough already. A crossgun has more in common with a gun than with a bow. That can’t be argued. It should be completely removed from archery season except in the case of legitimate medical reasons. 

[Buckmaster7600]

Horsedung. It’s happened in a state right next door.  I don’t even hunt the state I live in because of it. Least not most places and very limited there. Once we had a real nice herd. 
Yes The liberal bag limits hurt that, baiting also doesn’t help but I’m sure some girls in NY can’t kill deer by not baiting as well. You only need to look at sporting goods stores mid state selling all the bait. 
The crossbow thing that’s most problematic is they bring firearm mentality into a season that doesn’t need it. 
One spot on the federal land I hunted for years is lined up with guys driving from minute one of opening day. They drive by you all day long just as in firearm season. How can you bowhunt there? You can’t, gotta move, than guys show up there, gotta move again. 
They also wish things easier and easier. Look at the crossgun shoots 2 bolts. The ten point garmin set that ranges for you. Raven claiming 100 yards. I’ll be honest any bow can do that. Surely any crossbow but the hang time of the arrow is just too long resulting in wounded deer. 
Firearm guys can learn for sure but they don’t want to learn, they want things easy. God almighty NY firearm is super easy and early enough already. A crossgun has more in common with a gun than with a bow. That can’t be argued. It should be completely removed from archery season except in the case of legitimate medical reasons. 

I’m against full inclusion but the second someone uses the term crossgun I quit reading, it makes you sound like a complete idiot!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[GreeneHunter]

1 minute ago, Buckmaster7600 said:

I’m against full inclusion but the second someone uses the term crossgun I quit reading, it makes you sound like a complete idiot!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I agree ..... Pictured are a Crossbow and a Crossgun ..... Learn the Difference !

 

[stubborn1VT]

1 minute ago, Buckmaster7600 said:

I’m against full inclusion but the second someone uses the term crossgun I quit reading, it makes you sound like a complete idiot!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Agreed Crossbows don't go bang.  They don't kill in the same manner as a firearm.  They are archery equipment.  I'm not saying that using a crossbow is "bow hunting", but to equate them firearms isn't logical.

[Gobbler Chaser]

42 minutes ago, Foggy Mountain said:

Horsedung. It’s happened in a state right next door.  I don’t even hunt the state I live in because of it. Least not most places and very limited there. Once we had a real nice herd. 
Yes The liberal bag limits hurt that, baiting also doesn’t help but I’m sure some girls in NY can’t kill deer by not baiting as well. You only need to look at sporting goods stores mid state selling all the bait. 
The crossbow thing that’s most problematic is they bring firearm mentality into a season that doesn’t need it. 
One spot on the federal land I hunted for years is lined up with guys driving from minute one of opening day. They drive by you all day long just as in firearm season. How can you bowhunt there? You can’t, gotta move, than guys show up there, gotta move again. 
They also wish things easier and easier. Look at the crossgun shoots 2 bolts. The ten point garmin set that ranges for you. Raven claiming 100 yards. I’ll be honest any bow can do that. Surely any crossbow but the hang time of the arrow is just too long resulting in wounded deer. 
Firearm guys can learn for sure but they don’t want to learn, they want things easy. God almighty NY firearm is super easy and early enough already. A crossgun has more in common with a gun than with a bow. That can’t be argued. It should be completely removed from archery season except in the case of legitimate medical reasons. 

I would really have to see what you describe as all these additional hunters lining up on federal land with crossbows to believe it. I hunt state land in NY and after Thanksgiving weekend of rifle you lucky to see a hunter. Even opening week isn't anything like that here in NY and I'm only 90 mins from Manhattan. If full inclusion will bring all these new hunters into the woods than that just might be what we need with dwindling hunter numbers. Truth is if full inclusion ever happens your vertical bowhunter ranks will drop because they are moving to xbows and you'll get a small percentage of gunner only hunters who will hunt crossbow.