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I think it’s the African trophy hunters ,that make us look bad . Now those who ,live and make their living off the land have been SSS for generations , which the masses never know about , unlike

Dam coyotes   

And to top it off has a bunch supporting poaching with the sss talk. Good job You morons understand it makes all hunters look like poachers right? Anti hunters live for this stupidity.

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11 hours ago, chrisw said:

I know right! And real easy to kill in September too. My lease is overpopulated with those nuisance bucks, guess I'll play conservationist and start thinning them out to help out. SSS Shoot, Skin, Sausage)?

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Snack Sticks and Sausage

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The problem with the coyote season in NY is, it protects the predator during the worst time of the year.  Spring is when the young yotes are born and the most young deer are killed to feed them.  Many states allow yote hunting year round.  I don't consider shooting predators to be poaching.  Illegal because NY says the season is closed, but not poaching, because they are not game animals, they're varmints.

We can kill porcupine all year long, as well as other varmints like red squirrels, but not yotes.  When someone can logically explain to me the wildlife management reason for not shooting yotes all year long, I'll start caring about people shooting them "out of season".  Right now I'm only opposed to it because of the penalty the government inflicts on people who do it.

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The problem with the coyote season in NY is, it protects the predator during the worst time of the year.  Spring is when the young yotes are born and the most young deer are killed to feed them.  Many states allow yote hunting year round.  I don't consider shooting predators to be poaching.  Illegal because NY says the season is closed, but not poaching, because they are not game animals, they're varmints.
We can kill porcupine all year long, as well as other varmints like red squirrels, but not yotes.  When someone can logically explain to me the wildlife management reason for not shooting yotes all year long, I'll start caring about people shooting them "out of season".  Right now I'm only opposed to it because of the penalty the government inflicts on people who do it.
Conservation laws are designed to protect most animals/fish from their spawning/birthing period because they are most vulnerable at that time. If NY opened a year round season I wouldn't really care, but they haven't. How does it look when half of the people on this site condone illegal hunting activity? You think that's something that makes us look good? Unless I missed something, NY has no shortage of deer. I hope even just a few people here can climb out of their boxes and do some research. Coyotes predation on deer is not very high. Other states have bobcats, coyotes, bears, mountain lions etc... Guess what they still have healthy deer populations also. This pre conceived notion that coyotes are going to wipe out deer is a preconceived notion that the last generation did not understand and unfortunately it gets passed down. Read some studies, most here are too belligerent to ever admit they are wrong, and the friend cliques keeps people quiet or agreeable even when they don't. Coyotes are part of the ecosystem, they play their part, like everything else. I used to hate them too, but for what? Because they kill a few fawns? So do cars, hay cutters and ignorant people. If anything in the ecosystem kills and wastes deer it's people. Coyotes aren't out going for kill counts or bragging rights, they kill what they need to survive, the same as every other animal. If Bears were more prevalent here would you also condone shooting them out of season? After all studies show they play a larger role in fawn predation than coyotes. And studies have repeatedly shown that fawn mortality is high, regardless of predator presence, same as any animal. We are no longer in the dark ages of information, there's simply no excuse for lack of education anymore, maybe instead of spending so much time in Instagram, Facebook and sites like these we should search for the truth more...
FYI these comments aren't all pointed at you, just a rebuttal to above.

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15 hours ago, Nomad said:

I think it’s the African trophy hunters ,that make us look bad .

 

No, it's the public's uninformed PERCEPTION of African trophy hunters that make us look bad. Someone paying many many many tens of thousands of dollars to a country's game commission to take an animal, money which goes towards conservation and protection of all the other animals,is decidedly NOT a bad thing.

 

As a side off topic turn, for as few elephants as there are left in Africa, there are still too many elephants in Africa. (too many people, not too many elephants). Sadly they're their own worst enemy, remnants of another age. They reproduce slow (two year gestation), pretty much destroy/kill everything they eat, and are very inefficient at that. (75% of what they eat comes out the other end the same as it went in).  So sadly as much as we may like having them around, there's really no place for them in a modern world inhabited by so many people.

Edited by cas
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Yotes, being predators, have a detrimental effect on many other game species.  They are not going to wipe out other game species, but they do reduce their numbers.  Especially when they cluster in a relatively small zone.  Reduced deer and turkey numbers result in reduced hunter numbers.  That is a negative for wildlife management and the economy, as well as hunting's future in general.

Closing yote hunting during their breeding season indicates NY wants to protect the yote population, even when they negatively affect other game populations.  There is no shortage of yotes in NY and most science indicates hunting them year round will not affect their population.  Therefore hunting yotes year round makes sense and fining people for shooting them when NY is protecting them makes no sense.  That's the logic the science presents.

I don't support any illegal yote hunting because the optics look bad, but I don't support laws that make no sense either, especially when they're applied for PC reasons and are creating bad optics.

BTW, I saw bear numbers get out of control in NJ when they were protected and the state sent out rangers to shoot them out of season.  The law isn't just when the government is exempt from it.  NJ has once again gone stupid with bears and soon we will see rangers shooting bears again when hunters can't.  Makes no sense.

I've also seen local towns ban the discharge of firearms and bows to stop hunting for deer, then pay private companies to come in and shoot the deer at night with "assault rifles", silencers, bait and night vision too.  None of which are legal for hunters in the state.  The law only applies to hunters.  Makes no sense not to allow at least bow hunting there.

Let people hunt yotes in NY all year round and this problem goes away.

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2 hours ago, Grouse said:

Yotes, being predators, have a detrimental effect on many other game species.  They are not going to wipe out other game species, but they do reduce their numbers.  Especially when they cluster in a relatively small zone.  Reduced deer and turkey numbers result in reduced hunter numbers.  That is a negative for wildlife management and the economy, as well as hunting's future in general.

Closing yote hunting during their breeding season indicates NY wants to protect the yote population, even when they negatively affect other game populations.  There is no shortage of yotes in NY and most science indicates hunting them year round will not affect their population.  Therefore hunting yotes year round makes sense and fining people for shooting them when NY is protecting them makes no sense.  That's the logic the science presents.

I don't support any illegal yote hunting because the optics look bad, but I don't support laws that make no sense either, especially when they're applied for PC reasons and are creating bad optics.

BTW, I saw bear numbers get out of control in NJ when they were protected and the state sent out rangers to shoot them out of season.  The law isn't just when the government is exempt from it.  NJ has once again gone stupid with bears and soon we will see rangers shooting bears again when hunters can't.  Makes no sense.

I've also seen local towns ban the discharge of firearms and bows to stop hunting for deer, then pay private companies to come in and shoot the deer at night with "assault rifles", silencers, bait and night vision too.  None of which are legal for hunters in the state.  The law only applies to hunters.  Makes no sense not to allow at least bow hunting there.

Let people hunt yotes in NY all year round and this problem goes away.

NY does not close season on yotes during breeding season .

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3 hours ago, chrisw said:

I used to hate them too, but for what? Because they kill a few fawns? So do cars, hay cutters and ignorant people. If anything in the ecosystem kills and wastes deer it's people. Coyotes aren't out going for kill counts or bragging rights, they kill what they need to survive, the same as every other animal. If Bears were more prevalent here would you also condone shooting them out of season? After all studies show they play a larger role in fawn predation than coyotes. And studies have repeatedly shown that fawn mortality is high, regardless of predator presence, same as any animal. We are no longer in the dark ages of information, there's simply no excuse for lack of education anymore.

I agree with you, So do your part and educate yourself with the LAW's of NY state.

NYS DEC

Your feelings don't matter to the farmer that loses livestock to an over abundant coyote population trying to feed it's young.

Or a neighbor that lost their precious little fur baby to a hungry coyote, after their daughter let it out to pee in the backyard.

I don't think "they kill what they need to survive" talk will ever remove the screams of the puppy being killed from her memory.

When coyote are destructive or a nuisance, they need to be removed and there are rules for doing that.

 I'm the Alpha predator and anything that is a threat will be dealt with.

If no threat, it will live.

The law of nature.

 

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3 hours ago, Grouse said:

Yotes, being predators, have a detrimental effect on many other game species.  They are not going to wipe out other game species, but they do reduce their numbers.  Especially when they cluster in a relatively small zone.  Reduced deer and turkey numbers result in reduced hunter numbers.  That is a negative for wildlife management and the economy, as well as hunting's future in general.

Closing yote hunting during their breeding season indicates NY wants to protect the yote population, even when they negatively affect other game populations.  There is no shortage of yotes in NY and most science indicates hunting them year round will not affect their population.  Therefore hunting yotes year round makes sense and fining people for shooting them when NY is protecting them makes no sense.  That's the logic the science presents.

I don't support any illegal yote hunting because the optics look bad, but I don't support laws that make no sense either, especially when they're applied for PC reasons and are creating bad optics.

BTW, I saw bear numbers get out of control in NJ when they were protected and the state sent out rangers to shoot them out of season.  The law isn't just when the government is exempt from it.  NJ has once again gone stupid with bears and soon we will see rangers shooting bears again when hunters can't.  Makes no sense.

I've also seen local towns ban the discharge of firearms and bows to stop hunting for deer, then pay private companies to come in and shoot the deer at night with "assault rifles", silencers, bait and night vision too.  None of which are legal for hunters in the state.  The law only applies to hunters.  Makes no sense not to allow at least bow hunting there.

Let people hunt yotes in NY all year round and this problem goes away.

Grouse speaks Wisdom. I hunt NJ- so, I  see Black Bears while Turkey Hunting down there. Black Bears everywhere you go and CoyoteDung all over the Trails.

  Wild Turkey Populations  in North NJ is down--- Wayy Down.. I  have called in 2 Black Bear in the last 4 years while Turkey Hunting in NJ.

  NY Turkey Hunters should be able to blast a Coyote that comes into Hen Turkey Calling and leave him lay right there. 

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I agree with you, So do your part and educate yourself with the LAW's of NY state.
NYS DEC
Your feelings don't matter to the farmer that loses livestock to an over abundant coyote population trying to feed it's young.
Or a neighbor that lost their precious little fur baby to a hungry coyote, after their daughter let it out to pee in the backyard.
I don't think "they kill what they need to survive" talk will ever remove the screams of the puppy being killed from her memory.
When coyote are destructive or a nuisance, they need to be removed and there are rules for doing that.
 I'm the Alpha predator and anything that is a threat will be dealt with.
If no threat, it will live.
The law of nature.
 


Save your trauma ridden stories for bedtime. I have been surrounded by coyotes growing up and aside from eating the occasional stray cat, no issues. I know plenty of farmers and they have no issues either. Go back to being afraid of things that go bump in the night.

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1 hour ago, chrisw said:


 

 


Save your trauma ridden stories for bedtime. I have been surrounded by coyotes growing up and aside from eating the occasional stray cat, no issues. I know plenty of farmers and they have no issues either. Go back to being afraid of things that go bump in the night.

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Farmers I know shoot  coyotes all year long. They carry a rifle on the tractors for that specific reason.

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Farmers I know shoot  coyotes all year long. They carry a rifle on the tractors for that specific reason.
I know a few that do too. I also know of one that got caught baiting deer and another who shoots "their" big bucks in September so the neighbors don't get them. I'm not sure what you're getting at? If a farmer does it then it must be ok for everyone?

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35 minutes ago, chrisw said:

I know a few that do too. I also know of one that got caught baiting deer and another who shoots "their" big bucks in September so the neighbors don't get them. I'm not sure what you're getting at? If a farmer does it then it must be ok for everyone?

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Point was you said farmers have no issue with coyotes. I too know farmers who get some venison early. 

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Posted (edited)
4 hours ago, chrisw said:


 

 


Save your trauma ridden stories for bedtime. I have been surrounded by coyotes growing up and aside from eating the occasional stray cat, no issues. I know plenty of farmers and they have no issues either. Go back to being afraid of things that go bump in the night.

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Wow, you really got me there !

I own the night and prefer hunting at night, so I don't run into trolls like you.

I've been hunting nusience and destructive predators with NV and thermal all over the US for over 30 years.

Unlike you, I actually take care of problems for people, not whine about them and come on the forum and talk shit.

Please refrain from making a bigger ass of yourself and try to reply to topics you might actually know something about while your sober.

 

Edited by Shoots100
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Wow, you really got me there !
I own the night and prefer hunting at night, so I don't run into trolls like you.
I've been hunting nusience and destructive predators with NV and thermal all over the US for over 30 years.
Unlike you, I actually take care of problems for people, not whine about them and come on the forum and talk shit.
Please refrain from making a bigger ass of yourself and try to reply to topics you might actually know something about while your sober.
 
For a guy that's been hunting nuisance animals for 30 years I'd think you should know how to spell "nusience" by now... I'm no troll, simply speaking truths, you can resort to childish insults, it doesn't make me look bad.

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On 5/15/2021 at 2:11 PM, fadetoblack188 said:

Not sure if this is true trying to verify.  Can you kill coyotes now and leave them lay and not harvest for fur right now? Even though they are not in season. 
 

seem to have a problem and want to take care of them before they get the fawn

  The smart landowner shoots every vermin on site. Wait until the pups hit the fresh cut hayfields and end the problem. 

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12 hours ago, Grouse said:

The problem with the coyote season in NY is, it protects the predator during the worst time of the year.  Spring is when the young yotes are born and the most young deer are killed to feed them.  Many states allow yote hunting year round.  I don't consider shooting predators to be poaching.  Illegal because NY says the season is closed, but not poaching, because they are not game animals, they're varmints.

We can kill porcupine all year long, as well as other varmints like red squirrels, but not yotes.  When someone can logically explain to me the wildlife management reason for not shooting yotes all year long, I'll start caring about people shooting them "out of season".  Right now I'm only opposed to it because of the penalty the government inflicts on people who do it.

Exactly. Typical of this state. 

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10 hours ago, WNYTRPR said:

NY does not close season on yotes during breeding season .

My bad.  I meant during the birthing season when the pups are born.

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19 hours ago, Grouse said:

Yotes, being predators, have a detrimental effect on many other game species.  They are not going to wipe out other game species, but they do reduce their numbers.  Especially when they cluster in a relatively small zone.  Reduced deer and turkey numbers result in reduced hunter numbers.  That is a negative for wildlife management and the economy, as well as hunting's future in general.

Closing yote hunting during their breeding season indicates NY wants to protect the yote population, even when they negatively affect other game populations.  There is no shortage of yotes in NY and most science indicates hunting them year round will not affect their population.  Therefore hunting yotes year round makes sense and fining people for shooting them when NY is protecting them makes no sense.  That's the logic the science presents.

I don't support any illegal yote hunting because the optics look bad, but I don't support laws that make no sense either, especially when they're applied for PC reasons and are creating bad optics.

BTW, I saw bear numbers get out of control in NJ when they were protected and the state sent out rangers to shoot them out of season.  The law isn't just when the government is exempt from it.  NJ has once again gone stupid with bears and soon we will see rangers shooting bears again when hunters can't.  Makes no sense.

I've also seen local towns ban the discharge of firearms and bows to stop hunting for deer, then pay private companies to come in and shoot the deer at night with "assault rifles", silencers, bait and night vision too.  None of which are legal for hunters in the state.  The law only applies to hunters.  Makes no sense not to allow at least bow hunting there.

Let people hunt yotes in NY all year round and this problem goes away.

Coyotes are built to survive, If you eliminate a few they will turn around and have a higher litter the following year. The coyote is an all mighty machine of survival. The way the disperse after their first year or so of life is to protect from inbreeding and protect populations. If their local population is high, they have fewer pups, if the population is low, they will have more pups per litter. They are really a cool animal to follow.  

You can literally hunt them all year and you wont wipe them out. Coyotes will only live where they can thrive. And this state is full of that.. IF they eat mostly deer sized animals they will be bigger in size, if they eat more small game than anything, there sizes tend to be smaller(Western yotes). This state could most certainly let coyote season open all year and they would most certainly survive. It may mess the population for a year or two but they would come back..   

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Posted (edited)

The problem with opening the coyote season all year would be an increase in deer population, beyond tolerable levels for motorists, farmers, and homeowners.  It is not all about hunters, but they should be the primary means of control.

That issue could be quickly  corrected by opening up all of archery deer season for the crossbow.

The way things are currently, we need to protect those coyote pups in the hayfields in order to keep our deer numbers in check.  Vertical bows are simply not an effective enough weapon to allow hunters to do that.

Bottom line, you want to hunt coyotes year round then you need to open up all of archery season for the crossbow.  It really is that simple.

If you want to blame a group for not letting you hunt coyotes year round in NY state, your focus should be on NYB.  They have successfully lobbied to prevent full inclusion of the crossbow for yet another year.

 

 

Edited by wolc123
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9 hours ago, chrisw said:

For a guy that's been hunting nuisance animals for 30 years I'd think you should know how to spell "nusience" by now... I'm no troll, simply speaking truths, you can resort to childish insults, it doesn't make me look bad.

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Can't get anything by you.

The truth is that I comment on subjects I know about.

You should do the same.

When you don't, you look bad, even though you seem to think the opposite.

I educated the forum about the LAW's pertaining to the taking of nusience + destructive animals out of season and yet you still comment that just because they have those laws, it isn't right to do so.

You have an issue, bring it up to the NYSDEC, who make and enforce the laws.

I agree with Wolc123 and LEG in almost every aspect.

Coyote are survivors and when their numbers are threatened, they adjust their breeding to counter that.

There are ways to eradicate them from an area, but that involves methods that are destructive to other species and not tolerated, as it should be.

I try to keep the predator population in check and only remove the problem animals from the picture.

As with deer, nature will takes it course at population control, but that is also not a pretty sight.

The deer population numbers are a different story, for a different sub forum, although it's all part of the big picture.

 

 

 

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, wolc123 said:

The problem with opening the coyote season all year would be an increase in deer population, beyond tolerable levels for motorists, farmers, and homeowners.  It is not all about hunters, but they should be the primary means of control.

That issue could be quickly  corrected by opening up all of archery deer season for the crossbow.

The way things are currently, we need to protect those coyote pups in the hayfields in order to keep our deer numbers in check.  Vertical bows are simply not an effective enough weapon to allow hunters to do that.

Bottom line, you want to hunt coyotes year round then you need to open up all of archery season for the crossbow.  It really is that simple.

If you want to blame a group for not letting you hunt coyotes year round in NY state, your focus should be on NYB.  They have successfully lobbied to prevent full inclusion of the crossbow for yet another year.

 

 

What would you know about vertical bow ? You sit in your clubhouse with the the crossbow at full draw waiting for a deer to wander by. 

Edited by Jeremy K
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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, wolc123 said:

The problem with opening the coyote season all year would be an increase in deer population, beyond tolerable levels for motorists, farmers, and homeowners.  It is not all about hunters, but they should be the primary means of control.

That issue could be quickly  corrected by opening up all of archery deer season for the crossbow.

The way things are currently, we need to protect those coyote pups in the hayfields in order to keep our deer numbers in check.  Vertical bows are simply not an effective enough weapon to allow hunters to do that.

Bottom line, you want to hunt coyotes year round then you need to open up all of archery season for the crossbow.  It really is that simple.

If you want to blame a group for not letting you hunt coyotes year round in NY state, your focus should be on NYB.  They have successfully lobbied to prevent full inclusion of the crossbow for yet another year.

 

 

Why not gun? 10/1-December? Or longer?

Edited by The_Real_TCIII
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