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Right now there is a war against hunting and hunters. And DEC seems to be on the wrong side.

What...in the middle of the night?

Hey everyone. Please take a minute to give this article a read. I just posted this tonight and it discusses my thoughts on hunting. How hunting is the future for all game animals, regardless of why you choose to hunt... http://www.adirondackbowhunters.com/2015/08/06/we-are-hunters-2/

WHHHHHHAAAAAATTTTTTT.... you gotta be chittin' me! First I've head of this. I think you're full of it!

I was working a booth at a Hunting Expo, an Anti came up and said. "If we ban or make hunting harder You'll have no use for your Gun in NY either". So I think the red tape is just that to make people lose interest in hunting or give up. You have to admit they are coming at us from every angle, Anti Hunting & Anti gun Groups. Or it could just be the DEC is just Screwed up, either way we pay.

Ha-ha-ha .... why don't we just see exactly how screwed up we can make things. The ideas keep getting screwier and screwier. However, I will say that such a thought could easily be something hatched by the DEC. That is kind of the way they are thinking these days. I know the gun hunters would be all for it. It seems that lately that season time slot is the envy of everybody in hunting these days and there is no shortage of people looking to push bowhunters out of it or glom onto it for themselves .... lol. And that thought always seems to come with the blessing of the DEC these days.

G-Man, let me ask a really obvious question. Not just to you, but to ALL the people talking about these changes.... They say that the changes were for population control, correct? They want to kill off a certain percentage of Does in some areas, correct? Why early bow season then?? They could make opening day of gun season Doe only and kill more Doe in 1 day then bow hunters could kill in an entire season. Bow hunters are such a tiny, tiny portion of deer kills, it makes no sense. I just won't hunt the first 2 weeks. The 15 or so people in my bow hunting circle said the same thing. This regulation will not change the amount of deer that are killed, it will just alter when they are killed. Next year the DEC will come up with another set of reactive hairbrain ideas that won't work. We are all just cogs in their revenue machine.

Thats not exactly a true statement. I agree that hunting is a form of population control, but that is secondary. Nature has its own population control. Without hunters (we have only been around for a couple hundred years), nature would balance its own populations as it did hundreds of years ago. What everyone is forgetting, and the MAIN reason for hunting / fishing season's and license sales is the revenue they receive off of it. This is #1. There is no close second. If it weren't for us outdoorsman, wildlife programs, including endagered species protection, parks, preserves, forestry, species studies, etc, etc,etc, etc, etc. would not exist. God knows that our bankrupt state can't fund the DEC. They can't even fund our welfare system for humans, let alone animals.

For christs sake. Better wether for aging gun hunters? Did you really just write that? Try pulling a 70lb bow back in December when you've been sitting for hours I need a deer within 30 yards. You need 300. I need the rut to even maybe get a chance. Ridiculous the entitlement the gun only hunter wants. Don't forget almost all us bow hunters use a gun too.

Nope, I believe you hit the nail on the head. Sounds like they want more control, surprise? Soon it will be the home of the Free and Brave but in Russia. They will have more "Freedom" than any American. What will you do when they start putting camera's in you area to "Protect people". Our society seems to not want freedom and would rather have more government control over all our lives. Or maybe I am the one who is a conspiracy theorist? One thing is for sure we are going in the wrong direction and NY seems to want to lead the pack.

Yeah...., definitely don't forget the rubbers,lol Gonna be a long weekend alone in the woods with your buddy and you never know what's gonna happen! You guys could stumble upon a tribe of naked bush bimbos infected with HIV and have to fiddle fudge your way out of a bad situation,lol

No. We set up a system that protects your rights, assumes your innocence, requires a preponderance of proof and allows a person some legal recourse if they happen to become a victim of the system that might morph into a gun grabbing scheme. That's the way the criminal justice system currently works for violent criminals. Why would we do less for people accused of mental incompetence by the very government that has a vested interest in seeing people disarmed?

I like the mohawk haircut on your boy. If you are ever in a pinch for a broom you can just turn him over and sweep away! LOL

Decided to cut out of work a few minutes early yesterday and take the kids fishing with my buddy down at Conesus Lake. Had a great time. My son caught a mess of sunfish, and learned how to cast by himself. My daughter learned how to fish with lures and had a great time throwing topwater. I caught a few largemouth under the docks and a couple on topwater. It was a fun evening, but now the kids insist that I have to get a boat lol.

Bow hunters have tried for a long time to get the Oct. 1 st. opening date in the Southern Zone . Do you rely think they would want it pushed behind Rifle season, especialy the elders of them.

Would my dog count as a "permitted weapon" in this contest? She got the one under the house yesterday!

I'm now hunting out of heated blinds...not a problem....I just wouldn't have any deer to shoot...for they would all be nocturnal here by then.

Stubby. The permit allocation numbers are NOT the desires take numbers. They factor in that not every hunter is successful and issue more permits than they believe will be filled. They just never divulge their mystery formula

My wife and I had spray foam insulation done on the house we built last year. Best decision we made for the home. Had our furnace set at 62 all winter and walked around in shorts and a tshirt. No cold drafts felt at all. Even with all the snow we got last winter we did not have 1 icicle on the house. Last week when it was in the upper 80's we didn't even turn the A/C on and it never got above 72 in the house. It is pricey to install but the savings on your fuel bill will be well worth it. With the big push on energy efficiency etc I think they should make it mandatory in all new home construction.

Exactly what I was trying to imply. I always stand up when I originally see the deer and position my body for the shot opportunity, slow and deliberate movements. As deer approaches, bow is then raised. When deer is about to step into opening where I can shoot, bow is then drawn slowly, straight back. Since I'm a dinosaur, my hold time is in the 20-30sec max time frame. Works for me! One final semi-related issue with hold time. For a newbie, lets start out with shots on a standing deer & not take shots at one that's walking. A gut shot disaster waiting to happen! If the deer doesn't stop, make him/her stop with some sort of noise. I made a blat with my mouth, which sounds more like a sheep or calf than a deer, but it works. How loud? Loud enough to get their attention, but not so loud it startles them and puts them on alert. May have to make sounds multiple times, each one somewhat louder until you get their attention. Oh yeah, then there's buck fever. Going to let you experience that for yourself and not try to explain it.

Lets revisit this wolf reintroduction storyline 20 years from now when the single attraction at Yellowstone are the geysers! Assuming they won't be viewed as so cute or beneficial when they've established a significant population, killed or driven off all the deer, elk, moose & buffalo and then migrated to more populated regions, huntable areas or ranch lands. Anyone else think there might have been a logical reason there was a bounty on them decades ago??? At least in NA, they are the true definition of a natural born killer, esp in packs!

I also pulled a card from one of my cams. Got a bunch of yearling and 2 1/2 year olds. The last 2 pics on the card, from this morning were of this guy. Im pretty sure this is Hooks, but need a head on shot to be sure. He is a 4 year old this year, and the backline and belly look about right for that. He always has his brows. Im not sure how much more growing he has, but he fits my bill for a mature buck. I passed on him 3 times as a 2 1/2 and had a 10 yard encounter with him last year during bow season. Hopefully this year he gives me a shot.

I apologize if this has been covered in the past couple of days but I did not see it. I think word is just getting around. I spoke with someone in the DEC this morning who informed me that word has come down in the past couple of days that the state is implementing the Doe Only strategy this year (2015). First two weeks of bow are doe only. Muzzleloader is doe only. I was told that many people at the department have been calling Albany to complain about the way the state did this. They did not get any feedback from department staff or ECOs nor did they give them any warning they would do it. Last everyone knew - it would not go in affect until 2016. Reg books are being printed this week and the new regulations will be out next week.

Leaving in the morning for a weekend at camp/deer camp. No four wheeler this trip, I have to replace the connector on my trailer. Still looking forward to the tent and cot, scouting, canned beef and canned taters for lunch tomorrow, Mountain House Chili-Mac for dinner, a few cold beers, and just being in the woods! Saturday, up before dawn, boil water, quick cup of coffee, then sit for a few hours watching a swamp. 9am BF break. More coffee and some corned beef hash. Walking the back ridge and re-working natural ground blinds. Lunch about 1pm, Hormel beef stew! Afternoon cutting wood to dry for deer camp. Just to be safe, maybe setting up the tarp over the tent as Sunday is calling for rain. Adjust natural blind near camp, Mountain House Spaghetti for dinner, then more cold beers and a couple rounds of chess. Yeah, no fancy steak meals on this trip, too much work to get done in daylight hours. In two weeks, bacon wrapped steak, fire cooked baked taters, and corn on the cob.

I didn't take what you said personally so no hard feelings but I just wanted to point out that I am a meat hunter and I am bothered by this new reg still. What if the only deer I see during mz is a buck? I have to let that meat walk, and one more deer that would have been taken lives on. DEC claims this is about deer density not protecting young bucks. Last year on gun opener I sat until almost 3pm before I shot a doe, reason being it was the only doe I saw. I had 7 young bucks around but the owner has a thing about letting those guys grow up a little, his land not mine so I respect it. If I had shot a buck early I would have been back up the tree after gutting it. I shoot doe, as many as I can as it is, I didn't need Albany to punish me for it while telling me to go shoot more. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I think you need to re-read what I actually wrote. I didn't say that nature makes population ideal for humans, I said it makes its own balance. And by balance, I am referring to what NATURE considers balanced. If food is scarce and predators are high, population will be low. That is natures balance. When food rebounds so would population. There is a very obvious correlation amongst these environmental factors. This may be a very tough concept for people to conceptualize, but I would argue as far to say that EVEN IF you eliminated hunting in NYS altogether, the deer population would remain the same. The DEC does NOT in any form have an impact on our deer heards. If hunters didn't kill the deer, the lack of food, predators, cars, etc would. Nature would balance them out. True statement. Darwinism at its finest.

Um, that would be because in suburban locations, city or county parks, etc archery gear is better suited to dealing with safety issues with houses, buildings, etc all around than a gun is. Quiet and less disruptive to the people that live there as well. Its really the only option to get hunters in there to help with the problem rather than blow craploads of cash on sharpshooters.

Agreed, there are more deer in the suburban areas. Why? Because there is no nature! it is essentially a sanctuary for "cute, cuddly" creatures. I'm not saying that we need to release a pack of wolves in Buffalo, NY, lol. I'm simply saying that absent of humans, nature does in fact balance itself. Not just by predation, but by food as well. When food is abundant, populations rise. When food is absent, populations crash. Disease creates population changes. There are a lot of environmental factors that go into that. Remove humans and it is survival of the fitest as Darwin would say. Add humans, and everything gets fouled up. We try and do natures job for it. Where I live, part of the "doe only" reg, the balance is just fine. I am in a rural area. The coyotes are taking out more and more fawns every year. There are even a few bears moving into town. The DEC reactive medling in buck to doe ratios, a natural occuring cycle in nature, won't ever change anything. In 2 years, the DEC will have another reaction to lack of Doe's and make it buck only, watch and see. You must remember a short time ago when it was virtually impossible to get a Doe permit right? You had to be there the first 5 minutes they went on sale to get one?? Everything operates in cycles. Populations naturally rise and fall. Our DEC, has no impact on that. This puts me right back to my original statement (and, yes, i agree with you there as well that the gov't will always get its money somehow), that without hunters (and outdoor sports), the billons of dollars in funding would be irreplacable. The DEC's only job is to collect revenue and make it "appear" as if they are effecting nature, when in reality, they are not.

First I would look for land adjoining state,county or other large tract that your food plots could draw from and give you more hunting land free. I would want maintained roads not seasonal or private with electric available as this makes the land more valuable and desirable when you want to sell. I would also pick a size and not reveal my budget cause I/m sure they can find you land especially hunting land for a decent price, the going rate they throw around 3k per acre or 4k usually refers to flat land that can be farmed. Hilly forested land is usually less and usually the good timber has been taken already. When realtors ask me my budget I tell them as little as possible. Good luck to your dad.

Makes sense. Wolves eat or push coyotes out of the area. Every wolf hunt I've ever been on they say if you are seeing lots of coyotes hitting the bait, wolves aren't nearby Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Just a quick comment since I am traveling. Spent one day in Yellowstone this week - the first time since 94. In 94 I saw many coyotes every day. I saw none this time.

definitely a lot. we've been telling our hunters to use DMAPs first over other tags. figure it gives DEC a better idea of what's going on and we know they'll all get reported. I've heard the three year deal will be them giving you the balance of what you didn't fill and then once the tag is more than 3 years old it'll be no good. It'll make our lives crazy ensuring we keep track of hundreds of them and impress the need on hunters to not loose them. I'm sure it saves DEC money as they're not producing so many though, so I'm ok with it.

Good God Wooly! that's one picture I wish you HAD NOT put in my head....

Yes Grow, even in some high density areas a bowhunter can have a rough go of it some years. Bow hunting is hard. It's supposed to hard. Murphy's law was created for bow hunters. Which is one of the reasons we love it. I would think a bowhunter passing on some does during the first week or 2 of the season while trying to shoot a big buck that they've scouted should be rather inconsequential terms of deer take for the entire season. I usually pass on does for first 10 days or so hoping to surprise a big buck. This year I will likely hunt a little less the first couple weeks. And I'll leave potential big buck stands alone. but I'll still get out and try to take a doe. especially if convenient (cold weather, short drag, have time to butcher, etc.)

First I can't see how this plan will work and I'm not for it. But bowhunters don't shoot does. the percentages are lower. The DEC is giving bowhunters a chance to prove them wrong, giving them a chance before they bring in muzzleloaders for a two week season. AND HOW DO BOWHUNTERS STEP UP TO THE PLATE AND HANDLE IT?? All there is is whining and complaining and I'm not even going to hunt comments!!! Bowhunters constantly refusing to shoot does has led to this, and its going to get worse!

Here's 2 record book wolves that my dad laid out to rest. Over 30 full days hunting over several years before finally getting a shot. Like I said previously, they are no match for hunters. Even trappers with snares in Canada struggle with catching wolves. They'd rather starve to death than come near a human Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Sorry for writing a book! Love this stuff! Regardless of the exact genetics all buck by 3rd generation wieghed the same. That to me says the food is the key factor in getting your deer to optimal wieght and health. They where much smaller with smaller racks and by 3 generation all weighed the same. Now in so far as antlers. We could discuss it to no end if we wanted. The way I look at it is this: Each buck will have a genetic code for the antlers they grow. (One part from Buck Dad and one part Mother Doe genes 50/50 roughly.) As they grow to the healthiest and has the best food available that will give him the best antlers. This age is usually anywhere from 4-8 with largest display of antlers in the 5.5-7.5 age groups. Throw injury, drought, parasites, disease, rut exhaustion and winter hardship into the equation of trying to get a healthy rack and its amazing any deer ever have a symmetrical set in the wild. Will the deer in your woods grow to over 150+ inches in bone? If the nutrients are available it is possible is what they are trying to say. Will every area do this, no. I agree with you dbHunterNY the genes in this study could be the same for 2 of the deer and one might be different. Not the greatest control but the results show that if given the opportunity all deer with great food become exceptional deer in the eyes of most any hunter, regardless of exact rack configuration. Think joe already said this. Deer have one hell of a LIFE!!! Think about if you actually had to survive in the woods as a young baby deer to your first birthday. Ponder that for a second. First thing you deal with is a swarm of parasites. The ones from mom and the hatching spring black flies among others. Then your chassed by a bear, coyote and even the fox tried to attack you! (Thanking mom for all the life lessons.) Any injury, sickness and or infestation of parasites can cause a deformity in your antlers! If the food you are getting is just enough to survive, you rack will show the results of a hard life. (Deer antlers get the nutrients last, the body comes first.) Deformed antlers can be caused by many things but when consistently seen I would think it is not due to poor genes alone yet more to poor nutrients from the food they are eating along with other hardships and stress. Or as Joe said the hunter is misjudging age and never giving the bucks in the area a chance to age. Interesting topic I must say!

Their needs are stated in buck take per square mile and dmp quota fill per square mile... how they come up with numbers with no mandatory check is just a swag

Well said. Thanks for sharing!

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1st two weeks doe only will throw it all into a tail wind. Bucks will breed only at night and sit tight during the day. They will know something is up when their lady friends are being targeted for abuse. They won't come out to defend but just will sit there and watch the slaughter from the thicket. But…….when we are done with our duty as conservationist to cull the herd they will come out…….seeking and searching for the leftovers, even a yearling will do. There won't be much left so bucks might just retire with the old-timers on the porch and talk about how it was back in the day….Happy hunting!

I can't answer fully either. Vertical bow, rifle & ML'er. I shoot a doe/fawn when I want UNLESS I stumble onto a blood trail like I did last year during gun season. A 165gr 30 cal bullet (from the 300WSM) to the back of a suffering button buck's head was the least I could do for the little guy. The bastard that didn't track him out should have his nuts twisted off........but I digress. Ultimately filling the freezer is the goal, toss in a decent (or not) buck and I'm fat & happy.

back in the day, you got one tag that was good for either sex during archery and buck only during the regular season, if you filled it during archery you were done (that changed later on)..........doe tags in most areas had to have 3-5 guys applying for one tag.....usually guys would take turns carrying it until it was filled. I think the multi tag system we have now was began in the early to mid 90's (maybe?) if not later.

You must be talking 'bout poachers right? Last I checked, guys moving into areas killing deer on properties that they weren't welcome on were considered trespassing poachers. Yes, that does make things more difficult for a landowner or region when you look at it that way. Someone like yourself threatening to reconsider what dmu's they hunt is not an issue seeing you likely already have access and approval. It won't change much in the grand scheme of things. My comment of gunners grinning for the moment was only directed towards the divide that has recently come about between the two implements.(gun and bow) There is a separation there, and some are failing to see this will have an impact on ALL hunters in the end whether they realize it or not right now by fueling this separation. The whole "it doesn't pertain to me" will one day soon..... so wipe that smirk off your face before someone wipes it off for ya. (DEC)

All this talk about the BAR i think I well shoot mine a bit this weekend.Been a couple of years since its been out..

I did my whole house with it when I built in 2006, it's expensive but we'll worth it in savings, I use to heat a 1000 ft trailer and would go thru 3000 gal of propane just for the winter, I now heat a 3000 sq ft house and use 1000,for the year including all my hot water and cooking. It's 2 to 4x more in. Cost but doubles the insulation value vs regular fiberglass. I recommend it

All I know is what I see and What in over 20 years I have seen is a growth in both body and rack with the ever increasing farming...I also know illegal or not and I can't say legally for sure..but know all the same... guys around me are putting out minerals big time....But the biggest increase has come with the growth of soybean and alfalfa plantings by the big dairy farmers and the very large local crop farmer he does beans...peas ..beets...and grains which he always over seeds with clover. This use to be potato country but the crop farmers sold most of his potato equipment and now does these other crops and is big into rotational and cover cropping.

if you buy the archery license AND mzzleloader its a combined tag. but you can buy just the archery or muzzleloader license in addition to your regular license.

Its been a very busy weekend, we got started Friday evening with mowing down the buckwheat and brush hogging the rest of the plots now that the weeds have been knocked down. I also hung a new camera in a spot that Ive been wanting to get one into for some time. Saturday morning we got started by bringing in a second tractor to run the tiller while the brush hog was running on other areas of the farm. We started by tilling a brand new plot that was an old hay lot that was plowed up and then not used, so it was kind of a rutted up mess. I went over it 3 times with the tiller before I moved on to the next plot. I did the buckwheat plot next, followed by the failed corn plot. Both went very easy, as we have been working them for a few years. The failed corn plot had received 250lbs of 15-15-15 when the corn was planted, but with little growth I figure most of it is still in the soil. I added another 150lbs of 15-15-15 and tilled it in. Next was another small, new plot that my buddy has been wanting to play around with for a few years now. After that, I headed down to two of our best plots and got them tilled up. The smaller plot always does great with no fertilizer, as its basically a flood bottom, but this year I figured Id give it a bit of a boost, and tilled in 200lbs of 10-10-10. The larger plot down there was full of clover that stayed from the mix we put in last year. I was considering saving the clover and spraying with cleth to kill off the grass, but I second guessed it and tilled the clover in. Last up was another brand new plot, which I went over twice before I called it a day. This morning I headed back down with the kids to plant. We started out in the failed corn plot. I rolled it, then spread DeerAg Double Beam Brassica mix, dragged and then it got rolled once again by my daughter. Next we went to the lower plots and rolled them both. In the larger plot, I spread a mix of PTTs and 2 types of Rape. That got dragged and rolled, and then I spread a similar mix in the smaller plot, but added sugar beets to the mix there. Dragged and rolled that, and moved on to the buckwheat plot. That got the Rape and PTT mix, dragged and rolled. The small plot my buddy is working on got done by him in Hog Radish. The last two plots will be planted in WR later this month. We also have a couple of other new plots that didnt get tilled yet, that still may get scratched up and done in WR. One thing I noticed was the buckwheat plot was almost completely weed free and super easy to till. Im thinking that any of our plots that are going to end up as fall plots will get planted in buckwheat in the spring to keep the weeds down and give the deer something to eat. Here are a few pics from the weekend.