2019 HuntingNY Bow/Archery Harvest Thread

[WNYBuckHunter]

2019 HuntingNY Bow/Archery Harvest Thread

Post up pics of your 2019 archery season deer here!
 
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Feel free to start a new thread if you wish to have comments in addition to posting the photo and story here.

[billey100]

Sat my first watch of the year this morning.  I have been skunked a lot recently during bow season and with two kids we really go through the meat.  I saw antler and a big body and it didn't take long to decide even though it's opening weekend to pull the bow back.

My kids and I really cut out some good lanes this year and luckily this guy walked right through one at 38 yards. I saw him coming slowly, he stopped just before the lane and I thought maybe it wasn't gonna happen.  He then took about 3 more steps.  He was quartering away ever so slightly but stopped perfect in the lane.  I put the pin on him and followed up my shot.  I heard it hit really hard and at first thought it was to far forward, but it turns out it tucked just behind the closer shoulder/leg and buried into the opposite side.  I watched him run and watched the arrow sticking out about half way and then the arrow disappeared.  I heard him crash at least once then nothing.  Gave it a good hour and went to the spot, not good blood which had me super nervous. About 20 yards away however I had great blood and a good tracks.  Followed it for about 60 yards and saw a white stomach.

I will be honest that one little tiny part of me thought wow no more hunting for 6 weeks but I got over it pretty quick.  I can find some time to take the kids duck hunting now.  I know I never post but I do read almost every post all day in the Live from the Woods thread.  It's great to read all the stories and I am thankful I have meat in the freezer.

 

[cdbing]

Went out for my first sit at around 1 pm. Didn't see anything but squirrels until just before 6 when a doe and fawn came in to my left. I was planning to take the doe since the fawn seemed to be big enough to make it on it own. I normally pass does with fawns in October.

A minute or 2 later I heard deer running and saw a doe come in to my right. She was acting weird like she may have seen me move or something. Then I saw the buck.

The buck followed the script and gave me a broadside opportunity about 18 yards. The arrow hit a bit high, but within a few seconds of the buck running off I heard it crash.

There was good blood at the point of impact and first few yards, but either poor blood or I suck at blood trailing thereafter. Decided to just go to where I heard the deer crash and after a few minutes I found it.

Great start to the season.


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[cdbing]

Photos of the deer.

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[Lawdwaz]

Hopefully a doe is worthy of posting here as that's exactly what I killed yesterday morning.

I wasn't on stand very long before a very respectable buck went by me at about 30 yards, too thick and too far for my taste. I saw another deer shortly afterwards in the same area as the buck but couldn't identify it.  Maybe 30 minutes later a commotion straight east of me turned into a small 5-6pt buck chasing a doe like it was November 1st.  Man was he dogging her........

Then maybe 20 minutes later this doe came by me accompanied by a couple fawns and a bigger adult doe.  I shot the first one and my guess is she was 1.5 years old......the shot was a touch back but caught the back of at least one lung.  It was a pass through and went about 125 yards.  I gave her 3 hours but imagine it was over fairly quick.

The scale says 95 pounds........

[turkeyfeathers]

What a satisfying day. Got up at 3:45 , quick scent free shower. Arrive at Gman’s at 6 am. Day before we discussed which stand I should sit in so I went to bed dreaming on that one. But with highish south winds he advises me of another. I climb up into a large permanent wooden stand with roof and settle in. Stand overlooks a small clover plot and pretty close to a ridge high atop a long way down. Just getting light I hear blowing and foot stomping into the woods along said ridge probably 50 yards from me. I think great , there goes the woods for awhile. At about 7:45 2 good sized doe and a fawn come into the clover. I had lasered trees, plot edge earlier to know the distances. Big doe at 24 yards quartering hard , I draw in anticipation of her shifting a bit , holding for what seemed forever and proceed to let off as other nice doe now in field grazing and broadside. I know she’s 30 years on the button.  I quickly calm my nerves , draw, noting anchor point , loose  grip with bow hand and gently hit the release. She was quartering just a little away. I see the nocturnal hit and know I hit a little high and back of intended. Arrow blows through and sticks in ground. She takes off down a lane and think I hear her crash. Then emotions take over , I question the hit , will I find her. Replay everything over and over in my mind. I’ve killed a decent amount of deer with gun and used to watching them pile up right there so this running away stuff panicking me. I climb down to look at arrow and have good blood. I text Gman I shot one and sent pic of arrow  but pic not going through as poor reception, same scenario with academy group and treeguy in the mix. Andrew calls and says she’s dead within 50 yards after I described hit and reaction of doe . Gman finally acknowledges text and says hang tight ill be there shortly. As he approaches stand low and behold the other 2 doe are coming down the trail to right below me again. I hand signal to Greg and wearing a blue sweatshirt and jeans these doe keep coming in not caring about him nor I just shot there friend an hour earlier. They feed into the small plot exactly where their friend took the arrow. At 24 yards the big one offering me a perfect shot but unsure of status of shot one I can’t shoot this one too.  They eventually meander off into the woods the way they came in  I climb down and we start to track.  Good blood , more good blood every 6” or so. Found where she tried to get up a little hill but couldn’t and turned around now heading towards the ravine. No not the ravine I think. She went about 50 yards to here and we peer into ravine and see white belly fur. Thankfully she only went down about 15-20 yards into ravine. Shot indeed was a smidge too far back but got lung(s) as had good bubbles along the short track. Think she stepped a step forward as she was feeding.  I’m overcome with emotion as I did it I did it I think. Last year the first time at the academy I couldn’t even draw this bow. 2 years of academy shooting , few 3d shoots with some academy guys , bow tech old glory  The Real Tc gave me , arrows Moog sent to me , 2nd year hunting Gman’s land   After my brother sold his land I hunted I had nowhere to hunt and Gman hearing this quickly invited me down. Thank you all to have helped me along the way. I’ve drawn on goiter buck and let off , drew on big nanny doe moments later to get busted by her , let 12 small bucks walk inside 20 yards last year , numerous fawns and a spike this year. I’ve also never had the joy of deer Uber and have previously dragged them all out a mile to mile and half. Today I got to enjoy something very familiar to me , a golf cart  The hour n half ride home I had to avoid wooly bear caterpillars one after another ( like hundreds ) on the road and fluttering monarch butterflies   What a day ! 

[Red]

I was out hunting gmans place this past saturday. We hung a ladder stand back in May in a nice thick area just above an apple orchard. All summer I kept saying that I wanted to hunt this stand opening weekend even though we built a huge sweet tower stand in my favorite spot and gman put in a food plot in front of the tower and there were deer on camera in front of the tower stand morning and evening. I still went with my plan to sit the ladder on the far end of the property. At 930 i look over my left shoulder and see a big bodied deer coming in through the thick stuff I see what appears to be a nice rack. I take my eyes off the deer grab my bow stand up and draw aiming at the opening where I seen him heading for as soon as he stepped that front shoulder out i released and my arrow and could see it was a perfect it he turned and ran the direction he came from. I could see a ton of blood on the ground from the initial impact and heard him crash but decided to relax and wait an hour. 5 minutes in to the wait is when the adrenaline set in and I started to shake for 5 minutes.  I called greg and he said he would be there in about an hour. I called the wife and another buddy to tell them the news. I normally would wait to spread the word but it was a 4-5 yard shot and i seen where the arrow hit.  Gman and Brandon arrived at 1030 and we had a short 75 yard track until we find my buck. I entered high lung and exited the heart.  The buck died in front of the pop up blind and food plot. Gman has this buck on camera eating in the food plot 20 min before i shot it.

The 4 wheeler was broke so i dragged her across the bridge of death lol.

Thank you Greg for allowing me to hunt your place and set up and build stands on your property and thank you for all of the hard work that you do with the food plots and prep work that you do that allows us to see and and hunt such a variety of wildlife.

[WNYBuckHunter]

I cant believe I have to do this already, but....

Only pictures with the associated story will be allowed in this thread. If you want to congratulate someone, please do it by clicking on the "like this" button for the post. There will be no exceptions.

[Rebel Darling]

He was a gift, and an offering.  I had him patterned on our backyard acorns around mid-day, and knew he'd come out an hour or two after the furnace maintenance fella drove off.  A few weeks earlier, the wife mentioned that she liked the way his antlers looked, a first for her...

When I saw him, I grabbed the bow from the basement, and headed outside, heart pounding.  The wind was favorable.  I stalked him in plainclothes and moccasins to within 20 yards, and peered up over my cover.   I watched him for a few minutes, munching on acorns, and lazily popping his head up every few seconds to check his surroundings. 

I couldn't decide on whether to let him walk, or to kill him.  I would need to get closer, or for him to walk towards me so I could shoot.  Then he saw me, and we locked eyes for what felt like minutes, but must have only been a few dozen seconds.  He started head-bobbing, and as he dropped his head, I dropped to a knee and drew the bow.  I figured his curiosity was going to pull him around the corner, and present me with an opportunity.  It did, but he quartered-to at 10 yards.  I'll let him walk.  I didn't want to punch a hole in his front left shoulder and ruin that meat.

Seconds went by, and while on my knee, full-drawn in jeans and a grey fleece, waiting for him to bust out, he stayed curious, and that quartered-to shot slowly became a perfect broad-side at 10 yards.  I let the arrow fly. I honored him with a quick, and clean kill through both lungs.  He honors my family with his gifts and his offering.

 

SIDE NOTES: I might pack moccasins now; they were silent on the somewhat wet leaves and twigs.  Also - note that the shot was a little high, because I didn't correctly account for how close he was.  The high lung shot killed him within 100 yards of arrow impact, but there was no blood after the initial 30 yards, and he died prior to any exhalation of blood.  It takes a while for the lungs to fill.  I tracked him on my instinct after re-starting the blood trail, and came up on him laying in a depression.

Edited October 7, 2019 by Rebel Darling

[hunterdan44]

Sons buck he shot on Friday 9:20 am. Following a basket six, shot at 15 yds. Weighed 167 with guts out.

[hunterdan44]

 

 

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[N_rones]

With the temperatures set to drop opening weekend i decided to take Friday off from work last minute. Ended up tagging this guy at 9:40 Friday morning. My best bow buck to date.

[WNY Bowhunter]

Edited October 10, 2019 by WNY Bowhunter

[First-light]

Hey we caught a deer! lol

Brothers son in law shoots this 5 pt right under the stand. Spine shot arrow went right through heart! 

[Tarheelsaint]

Was a great morning (10/10)...weather was crisp and very little wind. Decided to hunt before heading into work and if i got lucky i could always take the day off or head in late. Got in stand quiet and immediatlely heard deer moving around in the thick stuff to the north. All the movement shut down as the sun came up and birds and squirels started to make noise, i figured deer had been feeding all night and were headed back to bedding area before light. Around 7:35 i see a small doe coming thru the woods to my south working her way to the bedding area north of me. She got to 20 yards and was hung up for 15 minutes. She was nervous and something was not right for her to continue...I knew she couldnt smell me as wind was perfect for the direction she came from. She finally turned and took a couple big bounds back from where she came from. I figured another deer was in the thick stuff but i couldnt see anything and thought my morning was done.  3 minutes later i see movement in front of me and right away i see the antlers and tell myself its one of the shooters we have seen. I watch as the buck comes directly towards me head down and smelling the ground. He gets to 25 years and stops behind trees puts his head back and is licking the air, again i know wind is perfect so i wait till he puts his head down and just flicks his tail, i go to full draw as he steps out from trees and slight quarter to me, put my pin on his shoulder and touch release....i see blood instantly as he takes off, i can see him stop and i lose sight of him 30 yards from the stand. I make all my calls to let people know im gonna be late (and i need to settle back down as the aderenline was pumping)...i get down and go to where i shot him find blood right away. Its amazing how you watch and replay the shot and deer running marking every tree and bush from the stand but as soon as your on the ground it all changes! I follow blood for about 20 yards and there he is lying right where i lost him, double lung and one of the easiest track jobs ever. This buck was in FULL rut, his tarsel glands are black as can be, big neck and he had the definite smell of a buck in rut...makes sense now why that doe would not commit to heading to the bedding area, she was not ready for this guy to be around her. Good luck everyone, don't overthink the "rut calendar" or moon phases and when the "best" time to be in the woods is! The best time to be in the woods is anytime you can!!

[BBDEric]

Grim Reapers are deadly!!! Doe down!!!!

[chrisw]

Well today was my 8th sit of the year and the first deer I've seen, unbelievably. After a quick stand move yesterday in the pouring rain I climbed in this morning, at 7:40 2 does came out at 5 yds and the biggest gave me a 21yd quartering away shot. Entrance was behind the last rib, exit was low behind off shoulder. At the arrow there were intestines laying on the ground, not terribly alarming as I knew the angle and could see the exit as she ran. Waited 3 hours just to be safe, she was laying right where I last saw her. Spitfire Maxx heads are nasty! 2 minutes after I shot her my other cell cam 250yds away sent me the pic of a nice 8 walking by my other spot! Feels good to have one on the ground.

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[Rebel Darling]

She boosted my scouting confidence 10 fold.  I walked into a piece of the Pine Bush I had scouted via map, and when I arrived there, the sign was fresh.  I'm hunting from a saddle now, and my tree options expanded beyond what the climber requires.  I picked a slanted tree within range of a creek crossing and downwind of a trail that led to bedding.

I sat for hours with no sightings, but the sound of acorns dropping 30 yards behind me pocked the sit.  I trusted that the deer would be on their feet to feed, answering that dinner bell once the sun dropped below the trees.

The first doe cut across the creek at 4:40.  She routed away from me, and was in a hurry.  I had no time to draw on her.  The second doe cut across my field of vision uphill of me, browsing at the edge of someone's lawn about 75 yards away.  That was at 5:20.  At 5:50 the sun sunk below the trees, the temps dropped, and the groups of deer got up and on their feet. 

About 100 yards away a group of deer, with at least one large deer, started making their way towards me but never fully came into view, nor closer than 80 yards.  All I could see were bodies, and legs moving through the leaves.  At just after 6:00 p.m., I heard movement behind me, and two doe were about to cut across the stream, after eating on the fallen acorns.  I picked up the bow, and came to full draw at the 25 yard mark. 

Just as the first doe was about to come into a sizable shooting lane, she stopped dead.  She was downstream, and the thermals were most likely taking my scent down to her.  I had dropped milkweed from the tree, but the beech saplings around me hung onto them, and I forgot having read about stream thermals in the evening.  I adjusted slightly, and arrowed her through a thin opening between two pines.  Thwop!  Lungs.

Post-shot, I shook worse than I had in years.  I was pumped about the scouting, and my chosen setup.  While it almost failed me right at the end, it did work, and I seared the lesson of that spot's thermals into my memory.

The blood tracking story is a fond memory I have with @Canis Latrans, even though it cost him a ton of time.  I wouldn't have found that doe nearly as easily without his help, and I'd still probably be dragging that deer up out of there if he hadn't turned around to meet me.  I owe him some beer, and hope to hunt with him before bow season ends.

In the end, she ran about 80 yards and piled up.  She stumbled right after the shot, over some downed limbs, and I had lost the blood trail there in the dark.  Canis' torch light picked right up on the blood, and from there, she bled out until he walked right up on her, an easy trail.

Here's a poor pic of the deer, and the arrow shot:

 

 

 

Edited October 19, 2019 by Rebel Darling

[Swamp_bucks]

At 900 i got out of my stand because it was foggy and nothing was going on.  The woods were quite so i decided to scout and still hunt the ridge i was on a bit.  Didnt find the sign i wanted to see so i got back on the main trail and headed to the truck.  I made it about 150yrds when i heard crashing but couldnt see anything through all the young beech trees still all green.  I thought it was the flock of turkeys i bumped the day before in the same spot. 

I made it 10 more yards when i hear what i thought was a grunt.   Then. I hear 5 grunts in a row and catch deer about 50yrds in front of me.  About that time they take off running with the buck grunting the whole time.  So i drop my pack and race 20yrds up the path hoping they go past.  As soon as i got up to my spot and knocked an arrow 4 deer rush across it.  But i could still hear a buck grunting from the way they came.  About 30seconds later the deer i took out stepped out at what i thought was 30.  Ended up being 36 dropped into the arrow and it  went through front shoulder and lodged in the other hit lung and heart.

After he took off i still hear the buck grunting so i knock another arrow since i saw mine fall.  Another doe came across i could hear the grunting getting closer so i drew back and out came a maybe 6" spike grunting up a storm.  He ended up leaving and since i was giving my deer time to make sure he was 100percent  done. I grunted at him and he came back again and blew and left again(did this 3 times).  He had to of grunted 30 times.

Not getting one in 5yrs wasnt letting one go past and freezer empty it was a first chance i was taking it.  Arrow flew perfect finally have a setup i trust.  Now time to look for a bit bigger body deer.

The little man loved it.   Stayed on the truck for 30mins with it.  All on a piece of stateland.

[The_Real_TCIII]

At 7:50 this morning this buck came into the apple tree I’ve hunted over a few times already, this time I was able to slip an arrow into him. He was quartering to more than anyone should like, I was a little upset with myself for taking this shot but it worked out. I got one lung, no liver no heart no guts. Full squad on the track job and we found the broken arrow and three spots of blood.@treeguy has a tracking dog contact so I texted him all the info and told the guys lets back out and wait for this guy to get back to me. On the way out I said let’s check this one road for blood, last deer I shot there ran down it. We go a few yards and@sodfather yells DUDE HES RIGHT THERE!! And there he lay lol. If he was messing with me we’d still be fighting back there like Peter Griffin and the giant chicken! What a blast having these guys along and Andrew and Bizzy in the mix via phone Someone zinged him earlier this season and has a story


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[The_Real_TCIII]

Left off the best pic!


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[crappyice]

On stand by 6:15 and by 6:20 i hear the distinct crunch we all love. A shadowy figure comes creeping through at what i know is 18 yards and heads out.

7:15 brings another doe from behind me who decides she likes the smell of the Evercalm (regular strength) and is nosing the trail where i walked with it smeared on my boots. Gets to about 40 yards in some brush and decides that she would rather follow the other deer trail instead of mine. Hit the bleat can and no interest.

8:05..a nice doe comes through one level too low traveling North to South (left to right on your radio). Tickle some tines...she looks and not that interested.

8:15....whats that i hear? Yup! Coming from where the very first doe in darkness came which would put her at 18 yards...only its not a her but a spike i was hoping would be under the 3” to count as a doe foe the program.
Meat first - ZIPPED him!




Ran off a long way and when I lost sight i hear more crunch crunch crunch. Reload and sure enough....another spike who gets to star in my first deer selfie.



Wait 25 minutes or so ...climb down to find a complete pass through and good blood at the got site. Head back tot he tree to pack up a bit before i track and look up to see two more doe heading my way. Cant shoot them from the ground in this program so they head back from whence they came.

Long track that ended where i whiffed on a doe at 3 yards two seasons ago. Thats my tree in the background of this pic and the entrance (Nap Thunderheads)



Long drag made easier with a TF idea and some scrounging the local Ashley furniture store-deer taco worked like a charm.



What a day after seeing nothing in all my sits.


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[Gencountyzeek]

After being out way too late playing euchre with a bunch of buddies saturday night (i know wild saturday...god i feel old) waking up sunday was brutal. Brother in law showed up at 615 and off to the woods we go. I give him first choice on stands he picked a stand no one has sat this year, i took my favorite "swamp" stand. This is the 5th deer ive shot out of it in 3 years during archery. Anyhoo, early on he txts me theres a small buck walking down the path to me. Get my phone ready to video the beast. He did not disappoint, tiny spikes may not have made the 3" mark. He fed his way from down wind of me to up wind were i have a mock scrape set up. Got to watch him use the licking branch and off he went back behind me on my right. 15 minutes later i see a larger spike back were the little guy went, this guys spikes are slightly taller than his ears. Then a hour of no movement, at 905ish i hear some twigs snapping from behind over my right shoulder and see a doe and 2 fawns or 2 doe and a fawn. Never had a chance to get a good look at them all because a second later all hell breaks loose and a grunting maniac comes flying in after the doe and they all scatter. The glimpse i got of him told me he was good enough to warrant a shot. The doe came busting out of the brush and seconds later he came walking out. He was slightly quartering away at around 30 yards. Drew my bow and had the dot behind the shoulder as he walked. Hit the realse and saw the impact mid body arrow was in up to the nock...FU#K... when i hit the realse i stopped moving with him, first dumb move of my day. Called my bil and we sat for 20 more minutes, i climbed down checked a trail camera near by and we walked out away from the hit sight. I figured liver and was hoping it made it to 1 lung.

Brother in law went home, we had a meeting with a finacial guy. After our meeting i took my son back to go look. It had been 2.5 hrs from.the hit. Looked around at were i thought he was standing and couldnt find anything. Couldnt find sign of anything, so i went walking in the direction i believed the buck went. I could not find any sign of deer. At this point im very down on myself and just rushing through the whole search process hoping i just stumble upon sign 2nd dumb mistake of the day. My son yells to me he found hair, i head over and yep hair. I look for a few seconds and start slowly walking in the direction i think he went...im not getting any smarter here folks...cant find anything so i start calling deer search numbers and leave messages with a couple guys. We head in to go get pumpkins, bil and family were coming over for dinner so i knew i had more eyes coming later. After dinner we are watching some football, at this point i was contacted by a deer search guy and he would be coming put that night. Im content with that, my bil wants to go look. So a 615 we head out to look. We walk around were i thought the buck was standing...nothing, i take him to the hair which is maybe 15 feet away. We look around there carefully for a few minutes and boom, he finds a drop of blood. We are now finding specs every few feet. Very slow going (the way i should have been going the whole time!) Its now dark in the woods so flashlights and we r doin ok finding blood every few minutes, we hit a few spots were it takes awhile, one guy stays at ladt blood the other moves ahead. We eventually find the back half of my arrow. 15ft ahead it appears to buck makes a 90* turn. Bloid gets better spots the size of a baseball, then another, and another. Shine my light ahead and we are lookin at a white belly. Dead in his first bed. 

Lessons learned here, first no matter how long you have been hunting TAKE YOUR TIME ON THE TRACK! As soon as i couldnt find blood were i believed the deer had been, i started heading in the direction i thought it went. At the spot of hair, if i was facing 12:00, i belived he went towards 11 oclock. In reality he went to 2 oclock. So as i was going i was getting progressively farther from the deer. I was dead set on checking the area i thought he went, after finding no sign of a hit deer i shouldve been checking in other directions. It really comes down to just taking your time, and maybe what u think you saw, well maybe it happened a little differently. 

Im 36 years old, been bow hunting for 22 years... the saying "never stop learning" comes to mind.

[ATbuckhunter]

I got to my stand around 6:10 and was enjoying the nice cold temps until 6:22 when a deer blew 5 times behind me down wind. With the way things have been going for me for the last few months I was already in a bad mood thinking my morning was shot already. I was trying to be hopeful and around 7:42 I heard wha sounded like a couple steps behind me and when I turned I had a fawn standing broadside at 10 yards. I moved really slowly to grab my bow and get up, but at that time the neighbor decided he wanted to ride his quad down to his horses to feed them. The deer are used to us, but it decided to run 10 yards into some thick stuff. It stopped in a small window at about 23 yards quartering away and I figured its now or never. I took the shot and heard a good thump and watched him run away with its tail down. I thought I heard a crash, but I couldnt see where I hit it so I didnt want to rush to conclusions. The path it ran down has a trail cam on it and has very tall grass so I didnt want to walk down it and pick up a tick again. I circled around to where it should have came out in a small grassy opening and found a few drops of blood. I looked for more blood for the next hour and couldnt find anymore. I was getting really discouraged and decided to walk down a path it might have gone down but found nothing. Its all tall grass around as you can see so i remeber telling my self I could walk with in feet of it and not see it. Just at that time I look to my left and see it in the grass off the trail. It was a high quarter away lung shot so the cavity was filled with blood. I dragged it 200 yards to where i skin and quarter all my deer and by the end I was sweating like a pig and exhausted.

[Hock3y24]

Well today I almost didn’t get up, I managed to crawl into my truck and go to one of my favorite stands. Used black widow xxx estrous and dominator buck urine on a dragline. Wa supposed to be a east wind but it was blowing NW. 6:45 I hear a snort wheeze and grunting/ hear buck making a scrape, see 3-4 deer in the area of my dragline. They walk off into the woods at 7:05 but I don’t think they went far, at 7:23 I hit the grunt tube, out steps this buck at 18 yards grunting. I sent an arrow through him and was real concerned it was too low, he runs down hill and I loose him in the fog (could only see 50 yards or so) but his tail was down and it looked like a death run. I get down and checked the arrow and have bright blood and immediate blood spray. I sit back down for 2 hours to be safe and call a buddy to help. We went literally 50 yards of blood spraying everywhere through 4 foot weeds. A perfect heart shot. My 2nd biggest buck ever and 2nd biggest with bow. Guess I’ll be antler hunting in PA the rest of bow season. I didn’t weight him but I’d put him in the 170 lbs dressed range.