Vaccination

[Robhuntandfish]

8 hours ago, crappyice said:

The only teachers I heard who are not getting it now are not getting it because they are pregnant, wanting to be pregnant (some fear of unknown) and have recently had The Rona and planning getting it after the anti- body time lapses.

I get mine next weekend and got my mom an appointment for early March...wish I could trade with her since her fear of the disease really messed her up.


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Same here.  I told them I wanted to bring my mom's arm with me. She has hardly been out of the house in months.  Both counties nearby here have NO vaccines.  And people that have made appts have no guarantee that vaccine will be avail for those days. Hope more comes soon.  I would think by June it will be avail for most everyone.  Or at least I am hoping. And not because of what idiot sits on the throne but because more vaccine has been produced by these companies and Johnson and Johnson has theirs out by then too. 

[BizCT]

No worries... it’s just funny how we usually put more thought into choosing a hunting guide than in choosing a doctor

Me? I haven’t asked my personal doctors if they took it or not. I’ll see my primary in the fall for annual physical again.


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[knehrke]

Our vaccination rates among Strong physicians is nearly 100%. It is, as mentioned above, less among support staff. I personally don't know one doctor who has refused the vaccine. In terms of adverse effects, we are seeing some incidents now of folks reporting general myalgia the day after their second dose, particularly with the Moderna vaccine. But still nothing overly concerning, and lots of folks report no side effects at all. My 75 year old Mom and her husband got vaccinated on Saturday near Utica with no issues - I was very proactive getting them an appointment last Monday, as soon as the Kinney's Drug store online scheduling site became active. 

I respect people's right to their opinion and to make their own decisions. Please think though before spreading disinformation on  a public forum. It's important to clearly state whether you have facts on which to base your opinion or whether you are reacting to "what you've heard". Stay safe, stay sane, neighbors and friends.

[Jeremy K]

Do they know yet if people with anti bodies or those with the vaccine can pass the virus on to other people?

[phade]

Not politically motived here but in general, my understanding is that there are 32M vaccines in the US, with 12M administered so far (or thereabouts). So 1/3ish across the US.

This is a problem - the logistics and rollout is poorly planned IMO republican and democrat partisanship aside.

In leadership, problems develop when everyone owns the problem or nobody owns the problem. Someone needs to step up to the podium and start pointing fingers with directives that are based off of a team/consensus approach. 

It's not because enough people don't want it. My wife is scheduled for March 23...two months out.

 

[Chef]

Do they know yet if people with anti bodies or those with the vaccine can pass the virus on to other people?

They don’t, which is why they said masks are important still even for vaccinated people


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[Bigfoot 327]

The reported vaccine numbers here in Florida are lower than the actual numbers of shots given. Florida Health has told the various entities giving the shots to concentrate on getting the vaccine administered and the reporting paperwork can follow later. So when the news reports that "X" amount of people have been given shots, the number is actually significantly higher.

[phade]

4 minutes ago, Bigfoot 327 said:

The reported vaccine numbers here in Florida are lower than the actual numbers of shots given. Florida Health has told the various entities giving the shots to concentrate on getting the vaccine administered and the reporting paperwork can follow later. So when the news reports that "X" amount of people have been given shots, the number is actually significantly higher.

Meh, my BS meter is high on that one. Not saying it's not happening to a degree, but to say that 32M doses are available at a 1/3 conversion rate, something doesn't add up.

They could be employing JIT or other various avenues and this seems like a crapshow; par for the course though I guess.

The Riverside Convention center here is getting 700 doses a day - they're begging for volunteers to come administer - doctors, nurses, dentists, etc. They don't even have enough needle pushers for the supply.

Edited January 18, 2021 by phade

[Nomad]

21 minutes ago, Chef said:

They don’t, which is why they said masks are important still even for vaccinated people


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Today’s NY Times is saying , the reason they want you to still wear masks, is once vaccinated folks stop wearing them , the unvaccinated will stop as well, causing  it to spread to more folks .

 

• Although no rigorous study has yet analyzed whether vaccinated people can spread the virus, it would be surprising if they did. “If there is an example of a vaccine in widespread clinical use that has this selective effect — prevents disease but not infection — I can’t think of one!” Dr. Paul Sax of Harvard has written in The New England Journal of Medicine. (And, no, exclamation points are not common in medical journals.) On Twitter, Dr. Monica Gandhi of the University of California, San Francisco, argued: “Please be assured that YOU ARE SAFE after vaccine from what matters — disease and spreading.”

https://messaging-custom-newsletters.nytimes.com/template/oakv2?abVariantId=0&campaign_id=9&emc=edit_nn_20210118&instance_id=26125&nl=the-morning&productCode=NN&regi_id=140974560&segment_id=49584&te=1&uri=nyt%3A%2F%2Fnewsletter%2Fbef2a621-8397-5b83-8f34-17ad0bb04bc6&user_id=c988984e0a8c1b71f8c97c903a4a8f69

[Versatile_Hunter]

1 hour ago, Nomad said:

Today’s NY Times is saying , the reason they want you to still wear masks, is once vaccinated folks stop wearing them , the unvaccinated will stop as well, causing  it to spread to more folks .

 

• Although no rigorous study has yet analyzed whether vaccinated people can spread the virus, it would be surprising if they did. “If there is an example of a vaccine in widespread clinical use that has this selective effect — prevents disease but not infection — I can’t think of one!” Dr. Paul Sax of Harvard has written in The New England Journal of Medicine. (And, no, exclamation points are not common in medical journals.) On Twitter, Dr. Monica Gandhi of the University of California, San Francisco, argued: “Please be assured that YOU ARE SAFE after vaccine from what matters — disease and spreading.”

https://messaging-custom-newsletters.nytimes.com/template/oakv2?abVariantId=0&campaign_id=9&emc=edit_nn_20210118&instance_id=26125&nl=the-morning&productCode=NN&regi_id=140974560&segment_id=49584&te=1&uri=nyt%3A%2F%2Fnewsletter%2Fbef2a621-8397-5b83-8f34-17ad0bb04bc6&user_id=c988984e0a8c1b71f8c97c903a4a8f69

This is the key: "Although no rigorous study has yet analyzed whether vaccinated people can spread the virus"

It'd be irresponsible to base public health policy on assumptions that haven't been empirically demonstrated, especially when the cost is so low (ie. wear a mask). I'm sure once (if) the data show that those vaccinated can't transmit the virus, it will be communicated clearly. That said, even then policy may recommend that everyone wear a mask until we've reach a critical mass of administered vaccines, and there'd be nothing wrong with that so long as the reasons are transparently stated. 

[Northcountryman]

I think I heard on the news this morning that they were saying that vaccinated people can , potentially, still be carriers; if true, they would still need to wear a mask, regardless of their staus of 'being vaccinated".  

[Jeremy K]

My thought is that the same number of people will still get sick and the same number will pass from this virus regardless of what we do ,all we did was spread it out over a longer period of time . Obviously i am no doctor but would to hear what an actual professional thinks about how we have effected/controlled the spread . 

[halfnelson]

Hoping the JNJ vaccine will pass all the prerequisites and be available shortly.  

[BizCT]

My thought is that the same number of people will still get sick and the same number will pass from this virus regardless of what we do ,all we did was spread it out over a longer period of time . Obviously i am no doctor but would to hear what an actual professional thinks about how we have effected/controlled the spread . 

Less will die going forward. Doctors aren’t surprised anymore, they have almost a year experience. Also, the sickly who died already cannot die again.


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[DoubleDose]

16 hours ago, Robhuntandfish said:

He sure funded them thru the govt which in glad for. Trying to get a vaccine out.  But they hate him right.  Lol. He has fast tracked everything and pushed the FDA to get it out. Man I bet those pharma guys can't wait to get him out .  Lol https://www.hhs.gov/coronavirus/explaining-operation-warp-speed/index.html

DJT/Fed funded some/most of the companies. Credit due DJT. Pfizer/BioNTech did not take 1 cent of Fed money and did it 100% on their own; and were the first to get authorization.  No credit due DJT.  Technically, he did not fast track anything.  Emergency use authorization, which is not FDA approval,  already existed (for just such a crisis) with no change in requirements/regulations. No credit due DJT.  The vaccines are not FDA approved.  FDA approval requires 2 years of safety data, no change in requirement/regulation.  Pharma has no friend in DJT or Biden as they are both for price controls of medications.  Pharma may have a preference for DJT based on corporate taxes.

[knehrke]

Total mortality is up, but percentage mortality is down - more cases, but we know how to deal with them more effectively, and more young folks catching it who aren't much at risk for dying. However, there are significant geographical and racial bias in disease severity (this isn't a statement about racism, lol, I'm referring to race in a medical sense as one important variable in the equation). And there are long-term consequences to your heart and kidneys, maybe your lungs. This is nothing new, think about lung scarring from pneumonia. There is still significant uncertainty in how pervasive or prolonged these effects may be.

Masks and social distancing slowed the spread. But so long as there's a large enough pool of "fresh" hosts that lack antibodies (from either the vaccine or COVID itself), then the spread will continue, albeit at a reduced rate. We've seen this many times with localized outbreaks of other diseases that we vaccinate against.

Whether you can still spread the virus after having been vaccinated is unknown, but the chance of imposing a significant viral load on somebody else are undoubtedly dramatically reduced. Ie, never say never. Why? Because your immune system needs time to react. If you can catch COVID-19 off a doorknob, chances are you could catch it if somebody sneezes at you with a viral load in their nasal passages.

So, will we ever be free of masks? God, I hope so. But it's going to take some level of herd immunity, in all likelihood, first. 

Full disclaimer: I am not an MD but a PhD and Professor of Medicine engaged in biomedical research at a major university for the past thirty years. These views are mine alone, based on my read of the data, and do not represent the official position of my employer lol.

[DoubleDose]

On 1/17/2021 at 7:59 AM, Biz-R-OWorld said:

Still a ton of doctors, teachers, and nurses locally who are declining for now with the wait and see approach.

 

 

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23 hours ago, Biz-R-OWorld said:

 

That’s not true. I personally know many doctors who are not getting it yet


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15 hours ago, Biz-R-OWorld said:

 

The doctors I know who have chosen not to get the vaccine is for various reasons. They all were offered it weeks ago. One is currently breastfeeding. One is actively trying to get pregnant. But most are healthy, young and just taking a wait and see approach.


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15 hours ago, Versatile_Hunter said:

Nonsense, thats my world. Not 1 of the hundreds of doctors that I know is delaying the vaccine for safety concerns, and that includes pregnant ones. I’ll weigh my anecdote over yours, but there are actual numbers out there, let’s go off that. PSA: if you learn that your doctor didn’t want to get vaccinated, ask for your money back. 

 

14 hours ago, Biz-R-OWorld said:

 

Some of them are family members both blood and through marriage. I’m sorry to disappoint you but they aren’t getting vaccinated anytime soon.


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A ton of doctors, wait many doctors, wait 2 doctors one breastfeeding and one trying to get pregnant.  Although this is not consistent with the CDC guidance, I can understand an individual woman's concern and choice regarding potential effect on lactation and fertility.   Their refusal is based on that, and they happen to be doctors by profession (which is irrelevant).  This is not doctors  against the vaccine or vaccination.

Edited January 18, 2021 by DoubleDose
typo

[left field]

51 minutes ago, knehrke said:

Full disclaimer: I am not an MD but a PhD and Professor of Medicine engaged in biomedical research at a major university for the past thirty years. These views are mine alone, based on my read of the data, and do not represent the official position of my employer lol.

Forget that. Do you have any third person anecdotes to share?

[Elmo]

15 hours ago, Jeremy K said:

My thought is that the same number of people will still get sick and the same number will pass from this virus regardless of what we do ,all we did was spread it out over a longer period of time . Obviously i am no doctor but would to hear what an actual professional thinks about how we have effected/controlled the spread . 

Even if those vaccinated can pass the virus, it greatly reduces the impact.  If you are not vaccinated, get the virus but is asymptomatic, you walk around for 2-3 weeks spreading it.  If you have the vaccine, your body fights off the virus after a few days so you're only walking around spreading it during those few days as oppose to several weeks.

[Elmo]

14 hours ago, knehrke said:

Full disclaimer: I am not an MD but a PhD and Professor of Medicine engaged in biomedical research at a major university for the past thirty years.

What are you talking about?  You post on the internet.  That automatically makes you an expert.

[First-light]

19 hours ago, Northcountryman said:

I think I heard on the news this morning that they were saying that vaccinated people can , potentially, still be carriers; if true, they would still need to wear a mask, regardless of their staus of 'being vaccinated".  

Saw a report on Fox news. An upstate NY nursing home had a spike in deaths after administrating the vaccination to over half the residents. Doctor said while you can be vaccinated you also can spread the disease to those who are not. Keep on wearing the mask! 

[Buckmaster7600]

I think it’s bullshit that I can’t give my vaccinations to someone else. I’m “essential” I was offered the vaccine but don’t want it and hopefully won’t have to. But why can’t I give mine to a family member that wants it?


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[Salmon_Run]

8 hours ago, Buckmaster7600 said:

I think it’s bullshit that I can’t give my vaccinations to someone else. I’m “essential” I was offered the vaccine but don’t want it and hopefully won’t have to. But why can’t I give mine to a family member that wants it?


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That's what happens when "government" and medicine coexist......

[Lawdwaz]

On 1/15/2021 at 8:52 AM, WNYBuckHunter said:

You can not accept it all you want, but all 3 of them are still laying in hospital beds as we speak.

John, how are your friends/acquaintances doing??

If you’ve already updated, I apologize.  

[DoubleDose]

9 hours ago, Buckmaster7600 said:

I think it’s bullshit that I can’t give my vaccinations to someone else. I’m “essential” I was offered the vaccine but don’t want it and hopefully won’t have to. But why can’t I give mine to a family member that wants it?


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Ethics.  You would end up with a situation where poor eligible people are selling it to rich ineligible people.